Help me identify plesase and how to build.....
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Help me identify plesase and how to build.....

  1. #1
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    Default Help me identify plesase and how to build.....

    Hey guys-

    My son in law gave me a BBC, not sure what I have. On the bell housing it has the casting #3969854, on the front passenger side it has stamped T0610CLB - 11C182886. From what I have found it's a 396 or a 402? Not sure, can you help me out? Want to build it for my 18' avenger jet and ditch my 455 (for sale/trade in the spam section). What ever it is, I want to build a nice "daily driver or rat rod" if you will. Not racing it, but a nice pump fuel running, give someone something to think about, kids can drive it, runner. I'm glassing in new stringers so now's the time to do it!

    Any advice would be great!

    Cheers!
    Last edited by Fabreezai; 08-19-2012 at 07:32 PM.

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    Blown, OHBA Member Wild Hair's Avatar
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    3969854....402.......70-72...2 or 4 bolt

    That's all the info on it that I have.
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    Built Cheyenne Tuff, With Chevy Stuff.
    well the block is GM any ways


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    Default Keep BBO....

    Hate to say it, but the Olds is a better "daily driver" type engine..... Plenty of torque for a tight jet, and it doesn't need high RPMs to make the power.....
    Ray
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    gn7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moneypit View Post
    Hate to say it, but the Olds is a better "daily driver" type engine..... Plenty of torque for a tight jet, and it doesn't need high RPMs to make the power.....
    Ray
    I have to agree, I am not a big Olds fan, but if you can't drop at least a 454 chevy or a 460 Ford in the thing, then I would keep the Olds. If you have to rebuild something anyway, rebuild the Olds.



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    Icy
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    I would never use an olds again in a boat... 11 rebuilds, all but 1 fault of the motor design (in my opinion), in 10 seasons. Spinning bearings like it's the motors day job. We named that boat "Blown Again".

    This is with many of the seasons as a cruising boat. We picked up a different boat and motor for speed fun.

  8. #6
    gn7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icy View Post
    I would never use an olds again in a boat... 11 rebuilds, all but 1 fault of the motor design (in my opinion), in 10 seasons. Spinning bearings like it's the motors day job. We named that boat "Blown Again".

    This is with many of the seasons as a cruising boat. We picked up a different boat and motor for speed fun.

    Very few truly bad motors out there. No end to bad builders. 4.5 million jet boats built with 455 Olds engines. How could they all be bad? If 10 of your 11 blew up due to bad engine design, whats keep the other 4.4999999 others alive?

    I blew up a shit load of blown BBC the first years of GN, but never once blamed the engine. I guess the ones I was racing against were proof enough that they will live. Ever see an Olds that was not blown up. I've seen tons. Wonder why those 455s live with such a badly designed engine.

    Every engine has its issues, and need to bbe dealt with or suffer. Some less than others, but they all require special attention to the details.

    If you're concidering going racing, stop the blame game NOW!. Because you'll fall into the habiot of blaming everything but yourself for everything that goes badly, or why your getting your ass spanked, and once you do that, you have beaten yourself, and doen the competitors job for him. You never tell yourself you were beat, you tell yourself YOU LOST!
    When you take an engine apart, it will tell you why it let go, and you address that. You don't simply reassemble another one the same way and hope that it stays together.
    No engine from Detroit was ever designed to make the power that most race engines make. So they fail and the good engine builders figure out why and fix it. I know your Olds was not a race engine, but the same applys. If your thinking about racing, you better change the WAY you think right now.



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    Last edited by gn7; 08-19-2012 at 11:18 PM.

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    Icy
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    I dunno what to say Gn7. I'm no engine expert and wasn't really at maximum thinking capacity of an adult during those times. It was nearly almost always spun main bearings. Could have been acceleration issues (in all directions) and oil getting to the motor that we never worked out. I don't know those times have past. We never lost the block, piston or connecting rod or anything like that... I don't normally blame the equipment but as a kid I wasn't impressed with the 455. Once I was a teen where I'd remember this stuff and being able to input my dad got shipped overseas and we never had an issue again when he came back before I moved out. There was a lot of missed opportunity to learn there.
    Last edited by Icy; 08-19-2012 at 11:37 PM.

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    gn7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Icy View Post
    I dunno what to say Gn7. I'm no engine expert and wasn't really at maximum thinking capacity of an adult during those times. It was nearly almost always spun main bearings. Could have been acceleration issues (in all directions) and oil getting to the motor that we never worked out. I don't know those times have past. We never lost the block, piston or connecting rod or anything like that... I don't normally blame the equipment but as a kid I wasn't impressed with the 455. Once I was a teen where I'd remember this stuff and being able to input my dad got shipped overseas and we never had an issue again when he came back before I moved out.
    The Olds has oiling issues and its pretty common knowledge. Not saying you should have known how to fix them then. You were young and you still are. Just saying get your head straight before you head off to race. Youth and enthusiasm will get smacked down everytime by age and treachery every time.

    There is a book written by a guy name of Carroll Smith called Drive to win. Get it. Big attitude adjuster



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    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    Very few truly bad motors out there. No end to bad builders.........
    +1000000000 True statement!!

    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    ....If you're concidering going racing, stop the blame game NOW!. Because you'll fall into the habiot of blaming everything but yourself for everything that goes badly, or why your getting your ass spanked, and once you do that, you have beaten yourself, and doen the competitors job for him. You never tell yourself you were beat, you tell yourself YOU LOST!....
    Good advice here too. You'll screw up parts, make mistakes, learn hard lessons and if you're lucky, maybe win some races.... I went through a machinest apprenticeship while in college not to be a machinest as a career but so I could learn to build race parts... same reason I went to college.... not to be an engineer, just to learn how shit works so I could race (well and make a living...). If you're wealthy, you can buy a lot of what you need, but it still takes 20 years to get 20 years experience....

    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    ....Every engine has its issues, and need to bbe dealt with or suffer. Some less than others, but they all require special attention to the details......
    And the more power you make, the more weak links you'll find... You think and Olds is bad, I know a couple old phucks that race a flat head Ford in a front motor dragster on about 30% nitro!! Talk about blowing shit up!!
    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    ....... David 519 is 100% correct........

    Quote Originally Posted by fuelinmyveins82 View Post
    .....I think people forget that racing is supposed to fun. Losing shouldn't be discouraging it should motivate you work on your pile to make it faster.....

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    Default Hey days....

    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    Very few truly bad motors out there. No end to bad builders. 4.5 million jet boats built with 455 Olds engines. How could they all be bad? If 10 of your 11 blew up due to bad engine design, whats keep the other 4.4999999 others alive?
    I blew up a shit load of blown BBC the first years of GN, but never once blamed the engine. I guess the ones I was racing against were proof enough that they will live. Ever see an Olds that was not blown up. I've seen tons. Wonder why those 455s live with such a badly designed engine.
    Every engine has its issues, and need to bbe dealt with or suffer. Some less than others, but they all require special attention to the details.
    And it was those boats, during the jet boat popularity explosion, that were out there playing around while the hot Fords and Chevys were on the beach "tuning"..... I can't count the number of Olds engines that were removed from a Stationwagon and expected to work in a jetboat... They didn't...Not for long anyway, and that is part of the stigma about Olds engines....

    Hardin Marine used good stuff in their Olds' engines... NOT the Detroit version.... And those old Hardin marine engines may still be running somewhere today in a decades old jetboat that has been taken care of.....
    Ray
    PS I too have seen many BBCs self destruct, but I've never blamed it on engine design.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wild Hair View Post
    3969854....402.......70-72...2 or 4 bolt

    That's all the info on it that I have.
    Thanks wild-

    have to pull off the pan to see if it is a 2 bolt or 4 bolt.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Moneypit View Post
    Hate to say it, but the Olds is a better "daily driver" type engine..... Plenty of torque for a tight jet, and it doesn't need high RPMs to make the power.....
    Ray
    I thought about that too. But from what I can find on the bbo I have is that it is not a marine engine. Seems to me it's a truck engine with "J" heads. I have done some stuff to it like blocking off x over in the heads, "the practical olds" rear cap mod, 10qt oil pan and drain backs on the heads. However to get anything performance is expensive and the selection that you can get is way less compared to chevy parts. I really would like to build the bbc but I do value the advice of you guys who have way more wisdom than I when it comes to these boats!

    If I do build the bbc, how should I set it up to be marine worthy?

    Thanks again guys for all the input and advise!

    Cheers!

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    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    Very few truly bad motors out there. No end to bad builders. 4.5 million jet boats built with 455 Olds engines. How could they all be bad? If 10 of your 11 blew up due to bad engine design, whats keep the other 4.4999999 others alive?

    I blew up a shit load of blown BBC the first years of GN, but never once blamed the engine. I guess the ones I was racing against were proof enough that they will live. Ever see an Olds that was not blown up. I've seen tons. Wonder why those 455s live with such a badly designed engine.

    Every engine has its issues, and need to bbe dealt with or suffer. Some less than others, but they all require special attention to the details.

    If you're concidering going racing, stop the blame game NOW!. Because you'll fall into the habiot of blaming everything but yourself for everything that goes badly, or why your getting your ass spanked, and once you do that, you have beaten yourself, and doen the competitors job for him. You never tell yourself you were beat, you tell yourself YOU LOST!When you take an engine apart, it will tell you why it let go, and you address that. You don't simply reassemble another one the same way and hope that it stays together.
    No engine from Detroit was ever designed to make the power that most race engines make. So they fail and the good engine builders figure out why and fix it. I know your Olds was not a race engine, but the same applys. If your thinking about racing, you better change the WAY you think right now.
    Damn...Those words should be carved in granite and taught in grade school. If you ignore that statement you may as well quit now and save yourself a ton of money and grief.
    Within the heart of every stray lies the singular desire to be loved. "Good grief you're an irritating blowhard...." [Tex 6/16/11]

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    Ok guy's, here is what I found out about the BBC-

    Thanks to a friend of a friend who works at the Chevy stealership, It's a 71' 402, oval port, 2 bolt, 330 hp, 400ft lbs, out of a Montecarlo. Said that Chevy still marketed it as a 396 in the smaller cars but a 402 in the larger cars and trucks, basically the same HP and torque as the 396 of the day despite it being another 6ci larger, according to him.

    I'm still at odds as to which engine to use BBO or BBC? or keep both, keep one for a spare and set stringers up to accommodate either engine? In any case, any incite on how to set up the BBC to be a marine worthy engine and possibly get 400-450 HP and more torque on pump fuel?

    Thanks!

    Cheers!
    Last edited by Fabreezai; 08-20-2012 at 11:55 AM.

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