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454 4 bolt 700hp

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12K views 68 replies 25 participants last post by  PCE680 
#1 ·
first off this will be my first build, second im on a budget. how do i get a reliable 700hp out of this motor. lets hear some ideas
 
#5 ·
I spent 9k on a 496 that got me to 83 mph then some ass wipe had to ask the question how much is ten MPH worth? I then proceeded to find out like a dumb ass. Over 16k later and an 18 MPH gain with a blown 496 I decieded that going faster wasn't worth it. But as Hammer said "Budget " That word only spells disaster when you are trying to get HP out of cheep parts. Spend good money on good parts and you have a better chance of it lasting a while. Research your build before you buy, Its time well spent.
 
#7 ·
First off is some insite

1 what is it going in, Jet, V drive, What pump, or gears & prop?
2 what are you expectations.
3 lake or race application? How many rpm do you want to turn this motor. what fuel? NA or blown.

before people can offer help they need to know where your going with this build. Then they will give you a whole new set of questions.:thumb:
 
#10 ·
Futs here on the boards is the man to talk to about your SWTD, his father owned Southwind. Maybe he will chime in here and give you a good direction to go with your boat. I'll check back tomorrow If he hasn't I will see If I can bring his attention to your thread.

You might throw up some pics of your boat and you wife and or girl friend, or both:)hand
 
#11 ·
BP would be another. He's been there done that :))THumbsUp
 
#17 ·
Doing it vs advising someone else..

I just built a 477 on a budget and it made over 700. It's 12:1, 4 in stroke, Canfield heads, Straub roller, tunnel ram. Mostly used parts. It can be done ;)
Sure, you could do it, Bob could do it, hell, I might even pull it off...BUT, we also have a selection of performance parts to put back into service... For years we raced Pro Stock with used parts. I've built more than one engine from the Recycler...... Here we have a guy wanting to kinda start from scratch, he has the stock stuff, but apparently, not a lot more..... When I did it, we were building "weekend bullets", one race weekend and tear it down to see what was ready to break... If you build a low budget deal, you're fully aware of the risks involved, and if one of those used, "serviceable" performance parts fail, it isn't the end of the world, you'll just pick up the pieces and throw something else together.... Now this guy, asking for advise, and "hints/secrets", is looking for something a little more "lasting"..... His performance goal is quite "lofty", and his budget, isn't....

So, all that said, IMO, his goals and his budget need to get a little closer together.. Steel's idea of 15K reflects how he would do it... My "guess" would be in the 8-10K range, whereas the OP was hoping to get 700HP for less than 1/2 that....Which could be done, but how long will it last? Even if you buy the very best pieces, there are no guarantees, there will always be a "weakest link" in any chain.....

I would suggest to the OP that he surf the "classified section" here on PB and pick and choose his combination from that selection of new and used parts.... Right now there are some really good deals on some really good combinations...496, 468, LS7 454, etc etc....
My last project, started in 2008 with the purchase of cylinder heads, then a gradual collection of other parts and pieces, bought "right" as the cash became available, topped out at about 11K. It runs, not sure how well yet, or how long it will live under extreme race conditions... Hopefully, it will live as long as it took to accumulate and assemble the parts!!! I had "goals", but never really a limit on expense to reach those goals....
Ray
 
#18 ·
i would say my budget is around ten grand, but over time, i dont have ten grand just to blow so it might take a while to build this motor. im definitly going to do a lot more research on this before i even start. i was looking around online last night and found a few creat motors, 540ci running 725hp from pan to carb for around ten grand. so there is definitley alot of ways to go. here are some pics
 

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#29 · (Edited)
Nice ride. You've recieved some good motor advice here. Personally, if I didn't already have a bunch of parts, there's no way I'd build a 454 when a 496/565 is basically the same price. Don't buy a crate motor, most need help before they'll live in a boat. If you want store bought, I talk to Joey Grose in Lodi or Tracy @ Sunset Racecraft. I've personally driven boats with thier engines in it... They haul ass and are as reliable as the HP level you choose allows. Tracy does a VERY nice pump gas/hydraulic roller camed 565 using all new quality parts for around $14k that makes around 750 HP.
That said, I'd also suggest if you want a faster boat, before you build more HP, make sure you're getting all the speed out of your existing combo. There's some VERY sharp jet boat guys on PB and a few have documented how they picked up LOTS of MPH by simply working on their combo. It's a common reaction to think "I wanna go faster, I need more HP!!". Most of the time lots of HP is being eaten by the combo and fixing the hull/pump stuff is much cheaper than building a bunch more HP. Seems very few take the time to optimize what they've got. Make the hull as efficient as possible and benefit from the "free" HP!!
Good luck...
 
#20 ·
Be very careful with crate engines. Most of them are built with very high profit margins by using seconds and blems, and minimum buiding standards.
The reason I said 15-18K is if you can get that number "OK" in your head, then you won't feel "pressured" to take every what you think is a good deal that comes along in order to fit your budget. Can it be done for 10K? Probably, but if you allow yourself a little more, you may still hit that 10k mark, but you won't feel forced to, and possibly compromise your build. This should be fun, not exasperating. ;)
JMO
 
#21 ·
Assuming...

I'm assuming, (I know, dangerous to assume anything), that the motor in the boat now, runs... If it does, don't touch it!!!! Enjoy the boat as is..... Pick up another block, put it under the bench, wait for a smokin' deal on some heads, put them one a shelf... Slowly, as your budget allows, accumulate the parts for the "brute" motor, but don't mess with the running one you have... Build the brute, take this one out, leave it COMPLETE, right down to every nut/bolt...and store it... If, and or when, the brute fails, put this one back in and continue to enjoy your boat... So many people take a good running engine apart and wind up storing their boat for a few seasons, which is never fun....
Ray
 
#22 ·
I'm assuming, (I know, dangerous to assume anything), that the motor in the boat now, runs... If it does, don't touch it!!!! Enjoy the boat as is..... Pick up another block, put it under the bench, wait for a smokin' deal on some heads, put them one a shelf... Slowly, as your budget allows, accumulate the parts for the "brute" motor, but don't mess with the running one you have... Build the brute, take this one out, leave it COMPLETE, right down to every nut/bolt...and store it... If, and or when, the brute fails, put this one back in and continue to enjoy your boat... So many people take a good running engine apart and wind up storing their boat for a few seasons, which is never fun....
Ray


I'd have to agree with that :thumb: If it aint broke, don't fix it :D
 
#23 ·
thanks moneypit, i think that is my answer. like everyone else i want a bad ass motor but my checkbook doesnt like the idea. what do you guys think the motor has been sitting for a long while and only been starting about 10 times in the last 20 years. and since its winter should i at least tear it down and go through it?
 
#25 ·
No. not necessarily



No, not necessarily... You should change the oil and filter, drain any remaining shitty gas.... I'd pull the plugs and squirt some Mystery oil in the cylinders, turn the motor over with the plugs out until you see some oil pressure..Crank it for 20 seconds, let the starter cool off a minute or so, and do it again...Repeat until you see oil pressure...OR, use a primer tool, but chances are you don't have one....Once you see oil pressure, replace the plugs and, (with cooling water of some sort, It's a jet, right? Wash the pump out really well with the garden hose, from the back, and from the bottom.... and fire it up...
Ray
PS cranking for oil pressure should also put fuel in the carb bowls...
 
#28 ·
I bought a used bbc bowtie block off ebay a few years back and drove over 300 miles to get it for 500.00 bucks 4.600 bore deal there are deals out there run what you got and pick up things as you enjoy what you have. I will say there is no going back to the small bore motors after running the big bore engines.
 
#30 ·
Dads SSRE 540 seems to be doing just wonderful.

oh wait its a Crate engine built by them,never mind :no:

i for no reason see why you couldnt buy a Crate(RACE)motor from anyone one of the top manufactures and be happy:thumb:
 
#31 · (Edited)
i for no reason see why you couldnt buy a Crate(RACE)motor from anyone one of the top manufactures and be happy:thumb:
Two biggest things would be the camshaft and the valves. You can run the stuff they use for valves, but I don't care to. Seen way too many "stainless steel" valves fail in a boat. Maybe in a drag only deal. But if your going to drive it like its installed in a 27 ft cat, you better BUILD IT. Not a simple "assembly" of parts.

One thing nobody is talking about on this "budget" deal is what you have to start with.
David 519 says it the same price to build a 496 and a 565. I think I'll have say I am not buying it, unless your buying EVERYTHING. Not necessarily new, but you have NOTHING. Like no block. Having a 454 block in hand, and comparing the cost to build a 565 when you already have a 454 block, your budget is going to change big time, real quick.

10 grand is doable, assuming you have some stuff to start with.



 
#43 ·
I built this from scratch, 454 .030.

GM Block, All eagle forged, Hyd. roller. 10K exactly counting new Brodix heads.

Dynoed just under 600 HP with a bad hyd. roller lifter at 5400 RPM.
It's only 9.5:1, for our Miller jet.

Simple piston swap, up the cam to a stout solid roller and 700 HP all day long would be pretty doable I think.
Scat crank and rods are barely more than Eagle.

 
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