blown injected alcohol with a centrifugal?
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blown injected alcohol with a centrifugal?

  1. #1
    Senior Member glastornjet73's Avatar
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    Default blown injected alcohol with a centrifugal?

    Anyone tried it? Good bad or indeffrent results? Thanks guys

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  3. #2
    gn7
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    If your talking MFI, forget it. You will never get the fuel curve correct. Many way better people than you and I together have tried, and its a dead end. Better than turbo and EFI, but still the throttle position has very little to do with boost with a centrif, and RPM/throttle position is all the MFI has to go by for the fuel curve. I guesss if you could come up with some boost referenced bypass in addition to a regular high speed bypass, you might get reasonably close.
    Trying to match a positive displacement fuel pump to a centrifigal air pump both feeding a positive displacement pump is a never ending fight . Thats what makes roots and MFI a perfect match.

    Now EFI and alky, thats a walk in the park and should work as good as any other boost method with alky.



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    Senior Member Hass828's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    If your talking MFI, forget it. You will never get the fuel curve correct. Many way better people than you and I together have tried, and its a dead end. Better than turbo and EFI, but still the throttle position has very little to do with boost with a centrif, and RPM/throttle position is all the MFI has to go by for the fuel curve. I guesss if you could come up with some boost referenced bypass in addition to a regular high speed bypass, you might get reasonably close.
    Trying to match a positive displacement fuel pump to a centrifigal air pump both feeding a positive displacement pump is a never ending fight . Thats what makes roots and MFI a perfect match.

    Now EFI and alky, thats a walk in the park and should work as good as any other boost method with alky.
    Hilborn has offered the boost referenced return/bypass for a LONG time. I have seen one in action and it actually worked well.

    Here it is from the Hilborn site
    Hilborn Fuel Injectors
    Last edited by Hass828; 02-10-2013 at 08:41 AM.
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    Senior Member EVILFORCE's Avatar
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    I have used twin turbos on top of a blower before with carbs. Does that count?

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    Senior Member Hass828's Avatar
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    There are lots of the car guys using blowthrough carbs on alky with turbos or pro-chargers. You see them on Yellowbullet often.

    Jack's boat is Blowthrough alky.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Hass828; 02-10-2013 at 08:58 AM.
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    Senior Member glastornjet73's Avatar
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    Yeah i have seen blow through stuff for a long time i just like injection better soo much easier to use tune and maintain i mnow i have seen a few guys to turbocharger and injection on a boat for short periods of time but i just feel roots blowers are dinosaurs using up soo much power to use when centrifugal have became soo reliable and affordable now i know blow through is always an option but i just thpught mfi would be cool and i like beeing diffren and like stay ing outside the box lol i like that boost refrence thing if it actually works

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    LP-25.com Infomaniac's Avatar
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    I've been chomping at the bit to try a MFI injection with turbos. There are some very successful racers using them. A boost ref barrel valve. Once wide open full boost easy to tune, the transition is the tough part. Wide open boost ramping up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Infomaniac View Post
    I've been chomping at the bit to try a MFI injection with turbos. There are some very successful racers using them. A boost ref barrel valve. Once wide open full boost easy to tune, the transition is the tough part. Wide open boost ramping up.
    MFI ??? surely your kidding.
    With mechanical injection setups I get a visual of a garden hose flowing into a bucket.

    Twin Turbo 1800 HP V-Drive lake boat

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trigger View Post
    No one cares about your buddies old antiquated garden hose technology.
    Quote Originally Posted by MAXIMUS View Post
    I think I could run more boost but it's a real hand full right now

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    New here Beer:30's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unchained View Post
    MFI ??? surely your kidding.
    With mechanical injection setups I get a visual of a garden hose flowing into a bucket.
    Not everybody wants precise-control of their fuel system, lest you forget.
    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    EFI is the wave of the future. There can be no denying it. Electronics have been on the leading edge of our entire lives. Not only os the magneto dead, but the standard issue CDI is wavering. Its all about total fuel, air AND spark control. Anybody that thinks its not has their head up their ass.


    2001 SleekCraft 30' Heritage SSB, open-bow mid-cuddy. 496HO / Bravo-I.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Unchained View Post
    MFI ??? surely your kidding.
    With mechanical injection setups I get a visual of a garden hose flowing into a bucket.
    Not kidding. Just another one of those life challenges. Just like EFI was.

    One of these days we might want to run a class that turbos are OK but EFI not.
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    gn7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Infomaniac View Post
    I've been chomping at the bit to try a MFI injection with turbos. There are some very successful racers using them. A boost ref barrel valve. Once wide open full boost easy to tune, the transition is the tough part. Wide open boost ramping up.
    You have to excuse Beer and Unchained. They are the offspring of the team on NASA engineers that spent 30 million of taxpayers money to develop a zero gravity pen for Astronauts. The Russians used a 2 cent pencil. Backwards low tech hicks.

    I tried this back in the late 60s early 70s with a SBF and a Paxton(s). I could have either decent Idle/cruise, or acceleration/power. Not both. Of course I didn't have the luxury of a "boost referenced" barrel valve or BR bypass. Of course I was trying to do this on gas which would be much harder to do than alky.

    Turbo and Hilborns ruled Indy for over a decade, but like Info said, its easy to get the top spot on. Their biggest issue back then was no POV and the turbos stalled in the corners and lagged off. That was when they actually had to drive the things thru the turns, not just nudge the wheel while holding it wide open.

    I still have the Hilborn and 1 Paxton from that deal. But no desire to try going down that road again.

    Blow thru is just too easy today and has more than proven itself.



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    New here Beer:30's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    You have to excuse Beer and Unchained. They are the offspring of the team on NASA engineers that spent 30 million of taxpayers money to develop a zero gravity pen for Astronauts. The Russians used a 2 cent pencil. Backwards low tech hicks.

    I tried this back in the late 60s early 70s with a SBF and a Paxton(s). I could have either decent Idle/cruise, or acceleration/power. Not both. Of course I didn't have the luxury of a "boost referenced" barrel valve or BR bypass. Of course I was trying to do this on gas which would be much harder to do than alky.

    Turbo and Hilborns ruled Indy for over a decade, but like Info said, its easy to get the top spot on. Their biggest issue back then was no POV and the turbos stalled in the corners and lagged off. That was when they actually had to drive the things thru the turns, not just nudge the wheel while holding it wide open.

    I still have the Hilborn and 1 Paxton from that deal. But no desire to try going down that road again.

    Blow thru is just too easy today and has more than proven itself.
    Could have all of that and more.......with EFI. But, you already know that - it's just too expensive for you.
    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    EFI is the wave of the future. There can be no denying it. Electronics have been on the leading edge of our entire lives. Not only os the magneto dead, but the standard issue CDI is wavering. Its all about total fuel, air AND spark control. Anybody that thinks its not has their head up their ass.


    2001 SleekCraft 30' Heritage SSB, open-bow mid-cuddy. 496HO / Bravo-I.

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    gn7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beer:30 View Post
    Could have all of that and more.......with EFI. But, you already know that - it's just too expensive for you.
    I think I have more than a few bucks tied up in my GN, its not the money, its the WASTE of money. Its the bang for the buck that will NEVER justify EFI in a performance boat application. HP for HP, $ for $, EFI is a major loser.



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  16. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    I think I have more than a few bucks tied up in my GN, its not the money, its the WASTE of money. Its the bang for the buck that will NEVER justify EFI in a performance boat application. HP for HP, $ for $, EFI is a major loser.
    Blaw blaw blaw.
    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    EFI is the wave of the future. There can be no denying it. Electronics have been on the leading edge of our entire lives. Not only os the magneto dead, but the standard issue CDI is wavering. Its all about total fuel, air AND spark control. Anybody that thinks its not has their head up their ass.


    2001 SleekCraft 30' Heritage SSB, open-bow mid-cuddy. 496HO / Bravo-I.

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