Bug Catcher Tune Up and Line Sizes?
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Bug Catcher Tune Up and Line Sizes?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Bigblockbill's Avatar
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    Default Bug Catcher Tune Up and Line Sizes?

    I just picked up a blown alky motor and am questioning the fuel system.

    I have made 2 partial passes in the car and it was either running out of fuel or hitting the rev limiter, scaring me, and lifting. Wish I knew which but never looked at the tach and it does not have a recal. The motor is pig fat and all the plugs have had none of the cad melted, so I am hoping I just was hitting the rev limiter, but now I am also questioning the fuel system.

    First the pump is a hilborn PG-150B that I know nothing about other than when you look at the hex input shaft it is slightly twisted. Trash or fix and flow?

    Second it has a short #10AN line from the tank to the pump and out of the fuel shut off valve is a 6AN adapted to 8AN with 8AN lines to the enderle cube. From what I read I am guessing I need a bigger line from the tank to pump... what about from the 3 way valve to the cube?

    Based on this web site and running the tune up calc it looks like the motor needs approx 4 GPM at 8000 rpm. http://www.fuelinjectionenterprises.com/

    The motor is a 400 cid, 12 or 13:1, running around 10-12 lbs of boost.

    Any Thoughts?
    24' Eliminator Fundeck

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  3. #2
    Senior Member Bigblockbill's Avatar
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    Just found out that the hilborn pump is a -0 pump so it seems as if there is no doubt now that it is undersized for the application.

    I will be ordering a new one first thing monday. Probably get an enderle 80A series. I will also upgrade the line from the tank to the pump to a 12AN while I am at it.

    My tank has 2 #6AN vent lines, is that adaquate?
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    Amber Racing Services BUSBY's Avatar
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    Call Ralph or Spike Gorr ... some of the best people you will ever meet. They'll walk you through it.

    Brian Bubsy

    http://www.gorrfuelsystems.com/

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    "It's HONDO, honey" Kyle's Avatar
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    You could go with the 80A but I personally but one size more fuel pump then needed it doesn't hurt if you return it to the tank, where you get into issues is the people that run a bigger pump than necessary and run the return back to the inlet on the pump. Short pump life. Get a 110. Simply put make all the lines the same diameter that way they all ahev the same potential rate of full flow and your not using pressure to make up for volume and visa versa. Good luck. Also what the shut off fuel loop look like on the pump?
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    adjones419 Wet-n-Wild's Avatar
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    I run a -16AN line from the tank to my Enderle 110 pump. Also, there's a big difference between 12:1 and 13:1 on a blown-injected alcohol piece. Ideal is 11.2:1 to 11.7:1. 13:1 is starting to get a little scary.
    Adam
    Hallett 210

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    Senior Member Bigblockbill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wet-n-Wild View Post
    I run a -16AN line from the tank to my Enderle 110 pump. Also, there's a big difference between 12:1 and 13:1 on a blown-injected alcohol piece. Ideal is 11.2:1 to 11.7:1. 13:1 is starting to get a little scary.
    I did not build the motor or car, but just bought the thing off ebay... imagine that. And the guy I bought it from did not know, or would not really tell me what the compression is... said he could not remember. I am half temped to tear the motor down this winter just to see what I have and if anything else is questionable.

    I ordered a pump from good vibs racing, and they recommened the 80A-1 and getting rid of all the port nozzles and just running hat nozzles. They also said a 10AN to the pump and 6AN out of the pump would surfice. I plan on upgrading to 12AN to the pump if there is room, will already go with 8AN out of the pump.
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    Senior Member Bigblockbill's Avatar
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    Strike that compression thing. I just did a compression check and they were blowing around 100 psi...remember I am at 5600 ft so add 20% more or so to sea level expectations. Does not sound like they are much more than 8:1 maybe 9:1 pistons. I have not done a leak down on them yet.
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    Village Idiot fc-Pilot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigblockbill View Post
    I did not build the motor or car, but just bought the thing off ebay... imagine that. And the guy I bought it from did not know, or would not really tell me what the compression is... said he could not remember. I am half temped to tear the motor down this winter just to see what I have and if anything else is questionable.

    I ordered a pump from good vibs racing, and they recommened the 80A-1 and getting rid of all the port nozzles and just running hat nozzles. They also said a 10AN to the pump and 6AN out of the pump would surfice. I plan on upgrading to 12AN to the pump if there is room, will already go with 8AN out of the pump.
    Jim at Good Vibrations is good at getting you in the ballpark with a good and "safe" tune-up. There are a bunch of guys that can get you all setup, but if you are going to try what they say, you have to do everything they say. Everyone I have seen that has continued problems tries some of every bodies supposed "tricks". Whether you listen to Jim, Gorr, Gene Adams or any other expert, you have to follow what they say to a tee. Otherwise you just took their years of experience and threw it in the toilet.

    Paul

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    Senior Member wagspe208's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc-Pilot View Post
    Jim at Good Vibrations is good at getting you in the ballpark with a good and "safe" tune-up. There are a bunch of guys that can get you all setup, but if you are going to try what they say, you have to do everything they say. Everyone I have seen that has continued problems tries some of every bodies supposed "tricks". Whether you listen to Jim, Gorr, Gene Adams or any other expert, you have to follow what they say to a tee. Otherwise you just took their years of experience and threw it in the toilet.

    Paul
    Hallelulah! To many cooks spoiled the broth.
    I have seen many a guy try to take advice from several different people and then be pissed off when something does not work.
    Remember, there are many ways to skin a cat. But only one guy can skin it at a time.
    Wags

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wet-n-Wild View Post
    I run a -16AN line from the tank to my Enderle 110 pump. Also, there's a big difference between 12:1 and 13:1 on a blown-injected alcohol piece. Ideal is 11.2:1 to 11.7:1. 13:1 is starting to get a little scary.
    Care to spill your guts as to what your tune up is......or is that secret?

  13. #11
    adjones419 Wet-n-Wild's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fiat48 View Post
    Care to spill your guts as to what your tune up is......or is that secret?
    Well, it's still a work in progress! Once we get it nailed, I'll run it by you. You and Wags are 80a guys I think, though.
    Adam
    Hallett 210

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    Yeah I have always run an 80a. I never messed with a 110 pump and was curious.

  15. #13
    "It's HONDO, honey" Kyle's Avatar
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    990 , don't even mess with the 660 just make the jump.
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  16. #14
    adjones419 Wet-n-Wild's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle View Post
    990 , don't even mess with the 660 just make the jump.
    990 on a bracket boat? I can't afford the fittings and stainless lines it would require to return all of that fuel back to the tank!
    Adam
    Hallett 210

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