Lifter failure "mystery"
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Lifter failure "mystery"

  1. #1
    Senior Member jetboatperformance's Avatar
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    Default Lifter failure "mystery"

    Thoughts and theories very much appreciated Guys, I've been doing this along time and this is new to me : Heres the scenario Fresh BBC motor has approx two hours on it starts to miss starts runs , good OP and has a miss and slight "tick" . 7 cyls have 150 compression, #2 cyl "0" , Josh started to pull the intake and heads found the first piece (pic1 and 1a ) in the oil return area at the rear of the R head found the lifter ball at the front oil return area (r side) The second picture is the base of the anti pump up lifter still in the bore as viewed in a small mirror The affected lobe (#2 exaust) is gouged from running on the damaged lifter but not flat , #2 exaust valve is bent and theres a very small ex valve "kiss" on #2 piston dome The CM pushrod is good and the Roller rocker is fine It looks like the bottom of the lifter simply "blew out? Thanks in advance Tom
    PIC 1
    PIC 1 A

    Base of #2 exaust lifter still in the bore

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    Senior Member GT Jets's Avatar
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    I have the same lifter from my buds boat..............


    The only thing I can give you is it was involved in a major overrev (ours), he didn't have a tattle tale tach, but I'm guessing 8,000 RPM for about a second, floated the valves really really hard and was missing when it restarted cracked the cam and blew the hardfaced area of the lifter off...Broke it right at the oiling groove...

    The machinist thought it was a loose lifter bore until I told him about the dumbass move with the water ski (long story, involved a foot throttle, too much sh!t in the bow and showing off...)

    Chinese lifters?

    GT
    GT


    Quote Originally Posted by Quickjet View Post
    Put a 300 on the back of it, Flywheel it and a nosecone. $15,000 later you'll have a 65 mph pile of shit......

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    Senior Member jetboatperformance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GT Jets View Post

    Chinese lifters?

    GT
    Nope (at least I don't think , supposedly high line anti P/Ups) Tom

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    steelcomp was here
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    Crap parts. Straub is out of town...we can blame him for a few days.
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    Senior Member jetboatperformance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelcomp View Post
    Crap parts
    Scott honestly as hard as we want a plausible explanation/underlying cause I'm staring to lean towards a simple part failure ? What else causes a lifter bottom to "blow out" ?Tom

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    Senior Member EVILFORCE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetboatperformance View Post
    Scott honestly as hard as we want a plausible explanation/underlying cause I'm staring to lean towards a simple part failure ? What else causes a lifter bottom to "blow out" ?Tom
    A bad part.
    No Fool Like A Old Fool is there?

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    Senior Member ol guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetboatperformance View Post
    Scott honestly as hard as we want a plausible explanation/underlying cause I'm staring to lean towards a simple part failure ? What else causes a lifter bottom to "blow out" ?Tom
    I have seen this before and found that the valve hung in the guide thus letting the lifter float freely until the cam beat the lifter into submission. qwik verify is to check the valve and guide for galling and or hot spots. depending on rpm, this all happens way to fast! M

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    steelcomp was here
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    Quote Originally Posted by ol guy View Post
    I have seen this before and found that the valve hung in the guide thus letting the lifter float freely until the cam beat the lifter into submission. qwik verify is to check the valve and guide for galling and or hot spots. depending on rpm, this all happens way to fast! M
    I think you PM'd me about something like this a while back didn't you? Never really didn get to the bottom of it, but in response to what you said above, I've seen the bottoms of lifters so beat up they wouldn't come out of the bore, but they were still in one piece. It looks to me like this was just plain ol' parts failure.
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    steelcomp was here
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetboatperformance View Post
    Scott honestly as hard as we want a plausible explanation/underlying cause I'm staring to lean towards a simple part failure ? What else causes a lifter bottom to "blow out" ?Tom
    That would be my guess, looking at the falure. Looks like a pretty clean fracture around the bottom of the lifter, Almost like where the heat treat stopped...
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    Senior Member jetboatperformance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ol guy View Post
    I have seen this before and found that the valve hung in the guide thus letting the lifter float freely until the cam beat the lifter into submission. qwik verify is to check the valve and guide for galling and or hot spots. depending on rpm, this all happens way to fast! M
    This is kinda what we thought (to some degree) at first but there no obvious 'trauma" to the valve stem or guide ? I'll get closeups of those tommorow , stumped otherwize

  13. #11
    steelcomp was here
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    The only thing I could see as a "failure" of some kind would be for the lifter to hang up in it's bore at max lift long enough for the piston to hit the valve causing it to hammer back on the lifter's internals and blowing the bottom out that way. Does the broken lifter move freely in the bore?
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    Senior Member ol guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelcomp View Post
    I think you PM'd me about something like this a while back didn't you? Never really didn get to the bottom of it, but in response to what you said above, I've seen the bottoms of lifters so beat up they wouldn't come out of the bore, but they were still in one piece. It looks to me like this was just plain ol' parts failure.
    Steel, yes I did P.M. you awhile back about simular situation. I have been off this thread for quite awhile and will now tell you what I found on my ordeal. After talking with my cam supplier I learned that a bad batch of lifters that had a ring cut into them were coming apart at that oil groove. But my lifters were not that style. Jetboats are so parts failure could be the case here. Stuck valve was the culprit in my senario. So now that jetboat responded back as to a negative on valve stick I would lean towards lifter failure and replace the whole set with a solid body style. M

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    steelcomp was here
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    Quote Originally Posted by ol guy View Post
    Steel, yes I did P.M. you awhile back about simular situation. I have been off this thread for quite awhile and will now tell you what I found on my ordeal. After talking with my cam supplier I learned that a bad batch of lifters that had a ring cut into them were coming apart at that oil groove. But my lifters were not that style. Jetboats are so parts failure could be the case here. Stuck valve was the culprit in my senario. So now that jetboat responded back as to a negative on valve stick I would lean towards lifter failure and replace the whole set with a solid body style. M
    Ahhh, OK...so ther was a groove around the bottotm of the lifter. I thought so...definitely a stress riser asking to fail. Might as well be a perforation labeled "Break Here"...
    If God is your co-pilot, change seats!
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    Senior Member ol guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steelcomp View Post
    Ahhh, OK...so ther was a groove around the bottotm of the lifter. I thought so...definitely a stress riser asking to fail. Might as well be a perforation labeled "Break Here"...
    Got me laughing on that one steel!!! The reason I felt that there might be another reason for failure and the lifter getting beat to death is if you look at the lifter in the mirror picture you will notice that the retainer clip for the inner portion of the lifter is missing! Super lose valve adjust can cause this but it just looks like it could be other factors also!!!! One thing for sure is I would drop the "break here" style lifters and make sure that all else is free moving and no chance of sticking or binding. M

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