Defective main bearing shell
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Defective main bearing shell

  1. #1
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    Default Defective main bearing shell

    This is prolly a fluke but if someone were to have a problem and I never said anything I would feel bad.
    Anyway:
    Speed Pro Main brg set 141M standard. Bearing has on back of it 7058 cha.

    This particular bearing shell that has something wrong with it happens to be an upper (with the groove). There is nothing visibly wrong....no burr around the oil hole, the tangs are correct. The bearing appears to sit in the main bore correctly.
    I don't have a ball mike...but I can't pick up anything with a normal mike that gives me any indication something is wrong.

    Putting the bearing shell in the block...measuring with a dial bore gauge.....you get .0035 clearance on the back 1/2 of the bearing....and close to .005 on the front 1/2. Any main brg hole you check.

    This only happens with this particular bearing shell.....replace the shell with another and the problem goes away. All other bearings in the set are normal and therefore clearances coming up normal.

    It isn't the caps on the block are incorrect or crooked (seen that before) or that the tang is hanging up on the block (ditto) or that there is a burr at the oil hole in the bearing.

    No question it is the bearing shell.....just a question of what is the issue with it.
    I threw it on top the toolbox and may borrow a ball mike sometime and see if it is a thickness issue or something.
    Anyway....assume everything is defective shit. Safer that way.

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  3. #2
    gn7
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    I think the very first thing I would look for in the shell, is if the ends are perpendicular to the side. It as if the shell is twisting in the bore as you torque down the cap. Like more crush towards front than the back. If you find out what it is, please let us know. I hate shit like this.



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    Yeah I got the same feeling on the twisting. Why I went looking at bearing tang and the hole.
    Hard to measure the ends cut perp...I checked with a square but couldn't see anything wrong. Ball mike will help sort it out. Never seen this before. Made in Mexico on the back of the bearing didn't make me feel better either. LOL.

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    gn7
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    Speed Pro, Mexico? Knew FM and Clevite were doing things down there, but not Speed Pro. Its like I posted years ago, they are pretty much all the same bearing in a different box with a different name. I have run clevites, Speed Pro, or FM in about 3 years. 100% ACL now. Some don't like the 3/4 groove, and I understand it. But the quality control seems to be much better.



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    I just finished the bottom end on an FE Ford with FM Race bearings. Not very pleased with them. The main shells were all tapered front to back two tenths and varied as much in overall thickness in the middle. The thrust bearing was .005 too thick on one thrust flange. One side was .100", the other was .105". Both bearing shells (upper and lower) were the same, but because they mirror eachother when installed, one had the thick flange facing forward, the other faced rearward. Little frustrating to say the least.
    My mchinist says he's had the most trouble with inconsistent measurements with King lately. ACL is proving to be a good bearing, and really well priced. Wish I could have gotten them for the FE. The only 3/4 groove bearing for the FE was the FM, and I wasn't going to put a fully grooved bearing in it. No reason for it.
    Last edited by scott foxwell; 07-10-2010 at 10:50 PM.

  8. #6
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    Speed Pro box.
    Federal Mogul number on box (141M) LOL
    7058 cha on back of bearing 10/08

    I think maybe I have found it.
    After typing that above post....went out there and chucked a "good" bearing in the mill....
    used a test indicator to check end straightness.

    Then chucked this one in.
    One side (the side with no tang) was straight.
    The tang side....was tapered.

    Surely that would **** the bearing slightly in the bore.

    I also took another bearing shell along with this one....made the circle...and miked the outside while holding it together. Damn if I could pick it up that way...didn't figure I could.
    Last edited by Fiat48; 07-10-2010 at 11:01 PM.

  9. #7
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    This is what I was thinking with my bearing issue. I had FM that had a wear pattern like the bearings were tapered as you found. Thats why when the shop couldn't find anything wrong with my parts I put in the ACL and figured it was good to go. Wish it would have been that simple.

    Tim

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    Gone in a Flash! Speed of Heat's Avatar
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    ACL is Who? -Figured the rest out...
    Remember that the Ark was built by amateurs and the Titanic was built by professionals.

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    gn7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed of Heat View Post
    ACL is Who? -Figured the rest out...
    All tri metal bearings are pretty much made from the blueprints of the original Clevite CL77 bearings. ACL is an Austrailian company (Automotive Components Limited) that manufactures tri metal bearings using the the same basic blueprints and materials. But it seems as of lately, their quality control is better than say FM/Clevite, and now, possibly Speed Pro. Its a shame. This did sound like it could have been River Rat 005's problem. But changing bearings didn't seem too fix it. Steelcomp,



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    Quote Originally Posted by steelcomp View Post
    I just finished the bottom end on an FE Ford with FM Race bearings. Not very pleased with them. The main shells were all tapered front to back two tenths and varied as much in overall thickness in the middle. The thrust bearing was .005 too thick on one thrust flange. One side was .100", the other was .105". Both bearing shells (upper and lower) were the same, but because they mirror eachother when installed, one had the thick flange facing forward, the other faced rearward.
    .
    Did you check the machining on the block and cap before trashing FM for doing that. As bad as Ford probably machined that thing, they may have been doing you a favor. Maybe they were trying to compensate for something. God only knows, somebody needs to make some compensations for the main oil feeds thru the bearings.



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  13. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    Did you check the machining on the block and cap before trashing FM for doing that. As bad as Ford probably machined that thing, they may have been doing you a favor. Maybe they were trying to compensate for something. God only knows, somebody needs to make some compensations for the main oil feeds thru the bearings.
    Um...gee...I guess I didn't think of that.
    I was referring to just the bearings, not installed. I just had it re-machined becuase the guy that did it before was handicapped. Or at least his equipment was.

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    I understand it was un-installed But really, is the block and cap machined any better. Maybe installed its not half bad. I think Ford only put a thrust bearing in them to keep the fan belts from peeling off when you stepped on the clutch. So close should be fine.



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  15. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    I understand it was un-installed But really, is the block and cap machined any better. Maybe installed its not half bad. I think Ford only put a thrust bearing in them to keep the fan belts from peeling off when you stepped on the clutch. So close should be fine.
    Well, this thing is looking at min. of 600hp, probably 6500-6700rpm. I can't afford close. Really trying to do a nice, comprehensive build on this one, but the parts are definitely causing their share of delays.
    The block is good...+/- a couple tenths on all mains, which is a far cry better than it was when it was brought to me. Bearings installed, I wasn't happy with the variations I was seeing, and knowing the guy who did the align hone, I would have been surprised to find the error in the block, so I started mic'ing the shells and found the variations. (Measured the block while I was at it) Got the clearance issues all sorted out, then stuck the crank in, checked thrust, and had .001"! WTH! Took the crank back out (not a lot of fun in a Y block), measured the flanges on the thrust bearings. The old ones had .100 on both flanges (same P/N FM bearing) and the new one had .100/.105.
    I guess it's not the first time thrust surfaces had to be massaged, and while I was there, I did some 'extra" massaging, but I've never seen this kind of inconsistency before.
    Again, never assume.
    Last edited by scott foxwell; 07-11-2010 at 05:15 PM.

  16. #14
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    Been using ACL since 2005. The bearing rep gave us the first set to try and I have never looked back. Have had good results with them. Good line bore and clearances still are the key.

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