Looking at a "Borum by Cheetah"? Any info?
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Looking at a "Borum by Cheetah"? Any info?

  1. #1
    Member Turbo Dan-O's Avatar
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    Default Looking at a "Borum by Cheetah"? Any info?

    I'm looking for a good Jet boat and came across this. 460/JE pump. The guy said it's a 19' Borum by Cheetah but I can't find much on them. The price is right and it's only two hours away. Should I snatch it up or run away?

    Last edited by Turbo Dan-O; 03-20-2016 at 09:36 AM.
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    Senior Member jetjunky's Avatar
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    The "JE" pump is a low budget insert pump and not recommended for higher h.p./speed use. If you just want a stock or slightly built motor they are ok. With a name like Turbo Dan it seems like you prolly prefer a little more giddy up out of your toys than what the JE is capable of. If, when the hull was built, the insert wasn't placed well/correctly etc. it can/will cause bad cavitation at higher speeds (75+mph). If you like projects they can be cut out and replaced with a standard intake adapter and all the parts from your current pump, you will just have to attain a good suction housing and build the pump. The pic. shown is a nice looking hull design. I'm not familiar with that particular hull to know if they are a good candidate for higher performance, speeds etc. What is the year model and how good of condition is it in? Most important is if there is any structural issues such as stringer delamination or other core rot issues?

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    Member Turbo Dan-O's Avatar
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    Not sure of the year and I haven't seen it in person yet. It's a full stringer boat and is supposed to be solid. Needs carpet and a few other small things that I can handle. I just don't want to waste my time on a hull that's not worth it.
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    Senior Member jetjunky's Avatar
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    I'm pretty sure it would be a splash of another popular hull mfg. such as eliminator, carrerra (which was pretty much a splash of elim. mostly) As I recall they were a mass production boat co. If it's full stringer and hand lay up then it's probably a decent hull. Maybe shoot old rigger a pm here on the boards. Having worked in the industry during that era he has an extensive knowledge of many of the manuf. from then. Carpet can hide a lot of issues, especially delam. and stringer/core rot. Are you familiar with what rotting stringers/core look like and how to do a tap test for delam?

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    Senior Member uniboarder's Avatar
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    The JE,F,G models get a bad rap why? Yes they are form fitted to the transom and are bolted straight to it. That's bad? The clean out is outside of the transom. That's bad? Split bowls bolt straight to them....is that bad? And they don't leak through the transom cover. Any pump has to have been rigged well to throw extra HP at it, don't pass on bad info just because you heard it somewhere.

  8. #6
    Member Turbo Dan-O's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jetjunky View Post
    Are you familiar with what rotting stringers/core look like and how to do a tap test for delam?
    I think so.

    Check this out...

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  9. #7
    Senior Member jetjunky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uniboarder View Post
    The JE,F,G models get a bad rap why? Yes they are form fitted to the transom and are bolted straight to it. That's bad? The clean out is outside of the transom. That's bad? Split bowls bolt straight to them....is that bad? And they don't leak through the transom cover. Any pump has to have been rigged well to throw extra HP at it, don't pass on bad info just because you heard it somewhere.
    Actually unibro my info. is from my own first hand experience with an E pump in my 18' Advantage specifically. It was fine with a warmed up BBF, ran in the low 70's and was fun. When I had a 540" pump gas motor built that dyno'd at 643 hp not so much. It exposed the flaws and weaknesses of the installation rather quickly all the way up to the point I blew pump off the back of the boat, literally. Only thing that saved my diverter and nozzel assembly was the cables. Boat would have sunk if not for the outboard bowl flange. Following that I cut out the insert and installed a full set back pump and re-rig of the boat. It was quite the learning curve and EXPERIENCE. The boat only got better, much better. Secondly, I agree with you as to the convenience qualities you mentioned of the E/F pumps but those aren't performance related qualities now are they? My response was specifically related to higher performance use issues, what about that was not clear to you? The "G" (aka split bowl) relates to the BOWL specifically and can be installed on about any berk style pump from Aggressor, Dominator to many others.
    Please, enlighten us on your EXPERIENCE specifically with the E/EF pumps. Sheese dude, not kuul.

  10. #8
    Senior Member uniboarder's Avatar
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    OK, I wasn't trying to start any trouble. I do have some experience with an E pump as well. (On my Sleek as we speak.) Jet boat 101 is anything over 500HP change to bronze or stainless impy, brace the pump, start experimenting with ride plate positions, stay away from loaders until you think one will be necessary, and make sure your hull can handle the HP. My new engine this season will bench dyno in the mid 500's. That's about what the semi-vee lake layup hull will take ride and handling wise. It has nothing to do with the pump IMO.
    Last edited by uniboarder; 03-20-2016 at 01:06 PM. Reason: Didnt mean to bug ya.

  11. #9
    Member Turbo Dan-O's Avatar
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    Great info guys. I have always wondered why the JE pump is kind of looked down upon. The two jets I have owned both had JE pumps and seemed to run good. Nowhere near 500 HP though...
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  12. #10
    Senior Member jetjunky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turbo Dan-O View Post
    I think so.

    Check this out...

    LOL....nice, I hope that guy has some really good game to keep the chicks from jumpin out when they see that. The stringer pick is a little hard to tell the true stringer cond. Typically, when really water logged, saturated, rotted etc. they will turn black and be mushy. Really have to inspect in person. If your seriously interested ask the guy to remove the interior, strip the carpet clean off the stringers entirely and provide you with detailed pics. Water will migrate thru any stringer penetration from seats, motor mounts etc. Most people don't bother to even attempt to add sealants to those areas when building/assembling. Additionally, on older boats the stringers are known to shrink some and separate from the glass, hence the tap test.

  13. #11
    Senior Member jetjunky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turbo Dan-O View Post
    Great info guys. I have always wondered why the JE pump is kind of looked down upon. The two jets I have owned both had JE pumps and seemed to run good. Nowhere near 500 HP though...
    JE pumps work fine for their intended use and application. From my experience I learned their biggest problem is from cavitation created by the way the hull builder place the block off in the mold during hull construction. I just had my buddies Carrerra mini cruiser here for a pump rebuild with inducer and his was done correctly, meaning nice smooth transition from the keel into the intake section. He's about 450 hp est. (also by imp. hp charts) I put a "B" cut Aggressor impeller I had here in it. We'll see where that puts him performance wise in a couple weeks. One other draw back to the E pump is you can't use an adjustable shoe to fine tune the pump. Additionally, I personally would be leary of hanging a good loader off the suction section do to the sandwhich of the glass etc and the load that could place on it. I believe I've read here in the perf. that some of the pump guru's have successfully put some pretty big power to them but then they should be able to with their resources.

  14. #12
    Senior Member uniboarder's Avatar
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    Adjustable loaders/shoes? If this was a Southwind/Place Craft/ CP question I would shut up. But its a 18' Cheetah. With blue printing the bottom and some expirement with the ride plate he can have a blast with that hull for everyday wages. No need to mess with the stock loading grate. Make sure there is no hook in the hull, put average HP to it and go have fun. 500HP+ will not be a problem if the hull is prepped, ride plate is tuned and PD/JOV goes up and down. I am still not understanding why you think an E pump would cavitate more than another? There was a reason why Berk went through A- G designs. Then American Turbine and Dominator took up the later models.

  15. #13
    Seriously off center slowride's Avatar
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    My experience with my old Circus boat (18' Advantage-Rogers open bow) mild 460, JE diverter, HiTech shoe/ride plate, loader was they are great up to around 75. Beyond that, the complication is the JE has a steeper intake angle and to go faster, you start chasing your tail. You need to load more water, so you need more horsepower, and at a rapidly increasing rate you just can't feed it. It will also become a bit more finicky in a semi-V hull. In perfect conditions, you'll go faster (if you throw more HP at it), but in varying water conditions it can either over load the intake (lifting the stern and causing handling concerns), or cavitate as mentioned earlier (cost me a bitchin MPD prepped "A"). It's ALL about setup at this point and a tad less forgiving than the same hull with a JC/G pump.
    All this said, I stopped at 75 mph as it was a nice boat, good manners, reliable, and yes the hand hole cover OUTSIDE was a big benefit on my stretch of river. Want a nice cruiser with decent speed, and want to haul ass? Buy a second that's better suited for bigger speed. My tug boat does 52 mph... period. When I want to go faster I'll fire up the Canyon.






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