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Newbe Questions

  1. #1
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    Talking Newbe Questions

    Hello All, I am new to this forum but have an old hat at boating. However this is my first Jet Boat. I grew up on the lake and can remember when my dad had his 18' Flat bottom 455 olds jet, (dont remember what hull), but i have wanted one ever sense. I now have a 1979 Sunkisst 18' 460 berkely pump, jetovator. I just got it friday and LOVE it... Guy told me it was a 70+ mph boat, but as typical bragging goes, he was wrong. GPS today showed 62 at 5200 rpm. now to the questions.
    I realize that the easiest way to equate speed is RPM.

    1, I am looking to target about 75 mph if possible, Does anyone know if the 79 sunkisst hull is capable of 75?
    2, it does not have a scoop intake but it picks up water great, does the drag you create by adding the scoop intake outway the gains, or are the gains worth it?
    3, is there an increase in top speed with a droop snoot , and what are the negatives
    4, ride plate , Pros and cons???
    5, Last but not least, I own a macine shop and we build performance engines for cars, I am wanting to build a roller cam, roller rocker, 7000 rpm 460. question is what rpm can the Berkeley Pump handle and what rpm do i have to start worrying about blow out? also will blow out be a problem if i do the intake scoop i asked about earlier?

    ANY AND ALL OPINOINS APPRECIATED.
    I know not all of you want to answer, but if you have .02 i want to hear it and will consider it all before deciding, i plan to post my decisions and share the results with you all.
    Thanks to you all in advance,
    George from Georgia with his new toy!!!!
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  3. #2
    Horsepower sells Engines lefty's pride's Avatar
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    im not going to be much help but nice boat. 7000 rpm that thing is going to need to push some huge #'s. that thing is going to be a wicked motor cant wait to see the pics. if theres not much done to the pump i think you would want focus on that
    "Horsepower sells Engines but torque wins races."
    "winners never quit, quitters never win
    those who never win and never quit are idiots"
    "if at first you don't succeed redefine success"
    "why is there never time to do it right, but there is aways time to do it twice"

  4. #3
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    Wanted to add a pic of the pump to get help identifying it and see if they even make a droop for it, I think its a 12JC, let me know if you know...
    Thanks George
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  6. #4
    Senior Member SoldHondaBoughtHondo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by customsandrods View Post
    Wanted to add a pic of the pump to get help identifying it and see if they even make a droop for it, I think its a 12JC, let me know if you know...
    Thanks George
    Geeezuz......can you plant seeds with that too? or is it limited to just plowing
    "A liberal paradise would be a place where everybody has
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  7. #5
    Senior Member lbhsbz's Avatar
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    Congrats on the new float...

    Looks like you've got a Berkeley JC pump. It's a decent starting point. you can run a place diverter (or trim, which you have) but in order to add a droop or straight snoot you'll need to change out the bowl to a split bowl, where the nozzle unbolts from the bowl.

    Before you even start thinking about that motor...do your research. I don't know a lot about hulls, but I do know that most of the older shallow V bottoms get kinda sketchy above about 85mph.

    You don't need to spin that pump to 7000.

    Here's a link to Duane's impeller cut/horsepower chart. Not 100% accurate due to a bunch of other variables...but it's a pretty good idea.

    http://hi-techperformance.com/images...r%20Curves.jpg

    most pumps come stock with an "A" impeller. If you want 7000rpms, you'd better make about 1100hp.

    The first thing you should do is go over the hull itself. Make sure the stringers and floor are solid and there's no rot...take care of anything that needs work.

    Then dive into the pump. A loader (scoop) will be of benefit at higher speeds. The condition of the impeller/wear ring is most important though...there are tons of threads in here on pump work/maintanence. Search and read up.
    Last edited by lbhsbz; 06-06-2010 at 11:09 PM.

  8. #6
    Senior Member lbhsbz's Avatar
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    ...and do something about that color scheme.

  9. #7
    Living in a cage of fear thatguy's Avatar
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    Welcome to rehab.....and congrats on the new addiction!

    Rethink your engine. My BBC is roughly 625 HP, and spins an "A" impeller to 5800 RPM, at 86 MPH. (79' Miller hull)

    I also had a stock JC pump at first. I modified it with a JG 2 piece bowl, a droop, and a diverter (as well as having the pump gone through and replacing the impeller with a stainless). Then had the intake re-set and added a very basic shoe (the "scoop" you mention) and ride plate.
    I also added a loader to the intake.
    If I did it again, on different boat. I would not do it all at once. I can't say what addition was the best, because I did it all at once. (The diverter and 2 piece bowl would be the best bet though)
    I would start with the 2 piece bowl and diverter. Then perhaps the droop snoot. If I then saw any cavitation I would add the loader. If I wanted to improve from there, I would then add the shoe and plate.

    I know nothing about your hull though, and that is just the general order I would do it.

    Jet pumps are different than a propeller.
    They can only absorb so much HP.
    The pump does not care if the boat is moving or tied to the dock. It does the same thing regardless.

    Build an engine that can run for extended periods of time, and live comfortably at 5000 - 5500 RPM or so, while making 550-650 HP and you will achieve your goals if the pump is working efficiently. (and the hull is capable)
    Concentrate on oil control, and build it for endurance, while keeping it under 6000 RPM.

    Several members on here have big inch Ford motors that produce incredible results at lower RPM's than 7000.

    BTW, when I bought the boat it was much slower than yours with a crap "re-builder" 454. I don't think it went 45 MPH.
    After building the engine, it went exactly 70 MPH. After the pump mods it did 86.
    Last edited by thatguy; 06-07-2010 at 02:42 AM.
    Tommy
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    Tommy please remove all Jimsplace quotes from your sig and don't put more back. He doesn't like it and it is against the rules. Thank you.
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  10. #8
    Senior Member SoldHondaBoughtHondo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thatguy View Post
    Welcome to rehab.....and congrats on the new addiction!

    Rethink your engine. My BBC is roughly 625 HP, and spins an "A" impeller to 5800 RPM, at 86 MPH. (79' Miller hull)
    86 with an IMpellor
    and
    105 with a PROpellor
    "A liberal paradise would be a place where everybody has
    guaranteed employment, free comprehensive healthcare, free
    education, free food, free housing, free clothing, free
    utilities, and only law enforcement has guns. And believe it or
    not, such a place does, indeed, exist: It's called prison."

    Sheriff Joe Arpaio
    Maricopa County Sheriff's Office

  11. #9
    "Mad" Member Jet Mad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sold honda.bought hondo View Post
    86 with an IMpellor
    and
    105 with a PROpellor
    LMAO

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  12. #10
    Living in a cage of fear thatguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sold honda.bought hondo View Post
    86 with an IMpellor
    and
    105 with a PROpellor
    Well, I do own both......and NEITHER is pink.

    Just sayin'.......
    Tommy
    Quote Originally Posted by Rexone View Post
    Tommy please remove all Jimsplace quotes from your sig and don't put more back. He doesn't like it and it is against the rules. Thank you.
    "So as through a glass, and darkly
    The age long strife I see
    Where I fought in many guises,
    Many names, but always me."

    Gen. George S Patton

  13. #11
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    Default Extra bullet

    Since you own/build engines, you'll understand me when I say, build the big roller deal as a "spare bullet", and leave the existing engine alone. When the "killer" is ready, stick the original under a bench somewhere for use when the roller spits out a part or two.....That way, you can still be on the water enjoying your jetboat.....I too, build engines, and I will say without a doubt, a jet boat is the toughest thing you can ask an engine to do. Vehicles sorta coast after a cruising speed is reached, feather the gas, and maintain the same speed. Not so with a boat, and especially a jet boat. Back off just a little and you're going to slow down, so the engine is under a constant load/RPM condition and depends on the boat "drying out" to relax a little.....Been there, done that......Vehicles hook to the ground, jetboats hook to nothing, and as such, 75%+ of boat performance will be found in a very expensive modified pump.....Engines are cheap, compared to pumps........Ray
    LOUD BOATS SAVE LIVES

  14. #12
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    Your Sunkisst is the heavy lay up as proved by the pic of the guy walking on the deck. On my Kisst you cant even lean on the deck, very light lay up. Your hull would be safe up to around 75-80 without professinal set up and make a great lake boat.
    No more Mr. Nice Guy !

  15. #13
    Senior Member harley222's Avatar
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    well another sunkisst owner, hell yea. i also have a 79 sunkisst but i have a 429 bbf with around 500+ HP and im around ur target mark for speed. torque is the key for a jet and look into the pump see wut cut it is and go from there. heres my sunkisst..
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  16. #14
    Senior Member harley222's Avatar
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    heres my 460 i just built, its a 528ci with almost 887HP and 725ft/lb, my build is in the michigan hot boats section under "my big ford" specs and all..
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