"APBA Hall of Champions - Comp Jets"
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"APBA Hall of Champions - Comp Jets"

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    JRPM/e-PerformanceMarine Squirtin Thunder's Avatar
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    Default "APBA Hall of Champions - Comp Jets"

    Quote Originally Posted by AZ Outlaw View Post
    Since the Comp Jet class is in the I.E. category, they are eligible for the HOC as well. As I recall, the Comp Jet class was the only I.E. class to have enough participants at their Nationals and Divisionals in 2011, so they still have a chance? unless the Kremlin of the I.E. category favors a V-Drive. My money is on the Rankmenian Navy.
    Quote Originally Posted by gn7 View Post
    last time I looked, I. E. meant endurance. When they start running 20 lap races, we can talk about the HOC. Or maybe we will all have to run at the same time
    RULE 8 • RACE QUALIFICATIONS, HIGH POINTS, CHAMPIONSHIPS
    1. An endurance race must be run on a closed course under one of the following formats.
    A. 100 miles or more
    B. 1 hour time duration.
    C. 15 minute qualifying heat and 45 minute final.
    D. Two (2) 30 minute heats with point accumulation to determine final order of finish.
    E. Thirty (30) minute duration which may comprise two (2) fifteen (15) minute heats with point accumulation to determine final order of finish.
    F. Fifteen (15) minute duration.
    G. 5 miles.
    H. Any combination of heats and/or finals when approved by the IERC as the format of a recognized racing series.
    RULE 13 • INBOARD ENDURANCE HALL OF CHAMPIONS SELECTION CRITERIA
    1. The IERC will determine the nominee for the Hall of Champions from the drivers placing 1st, 2nd or 3rd in each class in the APBA Inboard
    Endurance High Point standings at the end of the racing year.
    So Comp Jet racers what do you think the chances are for you to get in ? After what I have been hearing it is going to be slim to none. I know what you are thinking here he goes again stirring the pot, but I have facts for you to back up my claim. Right now in the IERC there are two GN owners and one Comp Jet owner. To my understanding the driver/boat getting in to this years Hall of Champions from Inboard Endurance category will have only won 2 races. Yes one of the races was the Parker 300 but it was not a Divisional nor a National event, in fact it was a special event. He did not set a record in closed course racing or kilos. He also did not score as many points as our second place Comp Jet driver. Our high points winner in Comp Jet was able to pull 4 wins and win a National event, our 2nd place Comp Jet driver was able to set 2 records and pull off 2 wins.
    The Hall of Champions requirements state the top three boats from the 3 classes and shouldn't the one with the most contribution and performance win the nomination? I am not real sure this is happening, being I have looked at the results and have really thought hard about this for the last 3 days. It has been stated that the Comp Jets don't really deserve to get into the hall. So we must do something about making a point system similar to the one they have in the Inboard categories. Mark cj169 and Ron cj511 worked very hard all season to accomplish what they did. Congrats to them both.

    2011 Inboard Endurance - High Points and Champion; http://www.apba-racing.com/YearEndRe...%20HP%20NC.htm

    High Points Summary; APBA Racing : News
    Use the dropdown to get to Inboard Endurance. Then you can click on the red points to see a breakdown of the races for each driver/boat.
    Jim & Amanda Rich
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    Jim Before this goes too far let me clear up one point. The gn's don't have as many points as the comp jets because CJ's ran more races.( Black Lake Wash) The agreement is that only the same # of races would be counted as points races. As you know we run sprint races ( 5 Laps) and the GN's run (10 & 20 Laps). However we are eligable for the HOC. The GN's ( 113 & 47 )had a fantastic year . The 47 actually had more wins while the 113 had more points and a enduro win Which is a points and a half race for them. I don't know who will go to the HOC as the top three points leaders are eligable but may the best boat win. There is a outstanding relationship on the IE commission ( GN 's and CJ's. )It's not GN"s against CJ's its about doing whats good for racing in the IE class.
    Last edited by terrytav; 12-23-2011 at 06:20 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by terrytav View Post
    I don't know who will go to the HOC as the top three points leaders are eligable but may the best boat win. There is a outstanding relationship on the IE commission ( GN 's and CJ's. )It's not GN"s against CJ's its about doing whats good for racing in the IE class.
    Well said Terry

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    JRPM/e-PerformanceMarine Squirtin Thunder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rossdbos View Post
    Gluck & Noble Crowned King's of the River 2011!!!
    Congratulations to GN-113 "The Nightmare" team of Greg Gluck and Mike Noble, Sebring, FL, on wining the 300 Enduro. By winning the Enduro, Gluck clinched the APBA Grand National APBA High Point Championship which gives Gluck his 1st induction into the prestigous APBA Hall of Champions. Greg & Mike took the overall win and 1st place in Division II. Team 113 had an incredible, near perfect day of racing.
    On behalf of RPM RACING ENTERPRISES, I would like to thank all the of sponsors, officials, volunteers, patrol boats, rescue, racers, families and crew and of course our fans and spectators that came out to be a part of this great event.
    Terry I understand what you are saying. According to the IE rulebook, we are running endurance races as I stated in my earlier post. That rule was not added in just for the cj class, it had been there for years. With the statement from gn7, (I.E. Commissioner) how do you feel this is an even playing field? Okay, we had 12 races to our credit and they had 11, that is only one day of racing. They came out in force for the Parker 300, a points and a half race. But did not make it to Long Beach, a National race. Question - Why did the cj not get the same chance at a points and a half race such as the enduro? Bascially somehow the GN's got an extra race, yes we had a "class" at the Enduro, but it was not a points paying event. I do understand that we have a great working relationship with the IERC and I am not trying to make this a gn versus cj thing. I just want the cj's to get there fair shot at the HOC. Now you said the 47 and 113 had a great season, which I am not disputing, however the 169 and 511 had an even better year. With what Ross posted and stated at two events, Greg Gluck owns HOC for 2011.

    My intention for this thread is that we need to get something set down in writing like the ones in the Inboard. Not just say the top three of each division gets nominated and hen the IERC chooses. So when Ted, Bob and yourself sit down to choose "What" is the criteria for IE HOC? What makes that driver stand out above the other nominiees? What accomplishments or is it just a popularity contest? Again we need something more in writing added to the existing rules.
    Last edited by Squirtin Thunder; 12-23-2011 at 11:56 AM.
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    Hey Jim, Terry, and Brad,
    After setting the the 2 records at Black Lake, we were working hard at the US-1 title, but we lost by 2 points. I had actually thought we had a chance at the Hall of Champions up to that point.

    Apparently we are not even worthy of it until we start running more laps. Nice to know we spent 3 full seasons out there and a couple of bucks along the way to get that kind of disrespect. That should piss off every Comp. Jet racer, I know it does me. I don't usually do this shit on the forums, but i'm fing shaking i'm so pissed. Looks like the GN's are Nascar and were the dirt car side show.


    Ron

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    Quote Originally Posted by 76 Bonneville View Post
    Hey Jim, Terry, and Brad,
    After setting the the 2 records at Black Lake, we were working hard at the US-1 title, but we lost by 2 points. I had actually thought we had a chance at the Hall of Champions up to that point.

    Apparently we are not even worthy of it until we start running more laps. Nice to know we spent 3 full seasons out there and a couple of bucks along the way to get that kind of disrespect. That should piss off every Comp. Jet racer, I know it does me. I don't usually do this shit on the forums, but i'm fing shaking i'm so pissed. Looks like the GN's are Nascar and were the dirt car side show.


    Ron
    Ron I agree 100%! Not only do we have to deal with a promotor that makes up rules to not accredit us or pay us out, now we have a comminsioner who looks down on us. Even after we show up with more boats and finish with more boats, and have made more races.
    Its a FORD thing chevy's arent quick enough to understand

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    Quote Originally Posted by 78CoLeBBF View Post
    .....now we have a comminsioner who looks down on us. Even after we show up with more boats and finish with more boats, and have made more races.
    now? Jeremy, thats been goin on since day one. I could go on and on how the SCSC has disrespected us as a class, but its besides the point here. This is APBA level and has nothing to do with a club who runs races in a local region.

    I've been looking at other avenues of racing (dirt track, drag racing, motocross, etc) and look how events are put together, promoted, ran, paid out, the sponsors, etc. It makes me want to sell my boat and go chase 10 thousandths of a second on an asphalt 8th mile. I'd spend less on entry fee's and have a better chance of makin a few bucks doin it.

    I love boat racing and i do it because I love it, but lately because of shit like this, (in addition to all the other BS we go through) its hard to get my heart into it.

    Someone needs to pull their head out of their ass before this class just up and walks away. again.

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    First and formost GN7 does not disrespect the CJ's. I have known Bob since i started racing and he has had nothing but praise for the class and how we have grown and the races we put on.He has his opinionon the HOC but He is only one member of the IE Commission so there fore he has one vote. He also likes very much to stir the pot. Now as for HOC nomination. It has already been decided that to keep an even playing field for points that we will use all the SCSC races plus Burley to determine points.Secondly a record ( Kilo , Course Record and Nat'l and Regional events ) will be taken into the equation to establish the HOC nomination.If you would bother checking the points and race records the 113 only had 2 wins but 5 second place finishes. the 47 had 6 wins and 1 second. It came down to the enduro to see who won high points. The CJ 169 and 511 taking out Black Lake finished with less points than the 113. Take a look at the Inboard Rule for HOC nominations and you will see that they do basically the same thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by terrytav View Post
    First and formost GN7 does not disrespect the CJ's. I have known Bob since i started racing and he has had nothing but praise for the class and how we have grown and the races we put on.He has his opinionon the HOC but He is only one member of the IE Commission so there fore he has one vote. He also likes very much to stir the pot. Now as for HOC nomination. It has already been decided that to keep an even playing field for points that we will use all the SCSC races plus Burley to determine points.Secondly a record ( Kilo , Course Record and Nat'l and Regional events ) will be taken into the equation to establish the HOC nomination.If you would bother checking the points and race records the 113 only had 2 wins but 5 second place finishes. the 47 had 6 wins and 1 second. It came down to the enduro to see who won high points. The CJ 169 and 511 taking out Black Lake finished with less points than the 113. Take a look at the Inboard Rule for HOC nominations and you will see that they do basically the same thing.
    So your saying the two records that Ron set at Black Lake are thrown out ? Also the 300 is now thrown out because it is an RPM special event, NOT SCSC. Why did it come down to the enduro for high points, there was a difference of 20 points between the first and second place GN's prior to the Enduro using only SCSC points, if you use all races the difference is only 17 points. Now for the cj's, using only SCSC the difference was 32, throwing out Black Lake the difference is 17 points and using all races the difference was 2 points. And the GN's needed a special points race at the 300 to determine high points ?????, again I ask you WHY not the cj's (just about the same point difference)? Actually using just SCSC races, the cj's had more points than the GN's, I did check the points. Now these are things that are going to kill this class as Brad stated. As far as the inductee for the Hall, Ross has already told us who it is on more than one occasion. Terry I am sorry that you have to deal with this during Christmas but it has to be dealt with as soon as possible.

    If I remember right, Comp Jet is a National Class, not a Local or just a Region 12 class. Basically if any of us raced CJ in region 14 at Lake Norman, NC, or any other region for that matter, the points would be thrown out. For you to throw out any of our hard earned races/money is wrong. Maybe this decision should have been annouced prior to the Black Lake Event or any other event not included in the determination. Another thing maybe if you stated earlier the decision for the HOC criteria this may have been averted. If you bothered to read my earlier posts, I stated that we need to come up with criteria similar to the ones in Inboard.
    Last edited by Squirtin Thunder; 12-24-2011 at 08:10 PM.
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    Jim, just for you information. the 5 mile race rule was, and has been considered for removale long before the CJs joined the category. Its a rediculous rule for the category as was only put in there LONG AGO in the event that there was a time issue and some event and needed to be used and still keep the race a points race.
    It has never once been used in the 11 years I have raced GN. The very shortest race we have ever ran as a points race was 10, and again, due to time restraints.

    Before you even consider whether any of you would like to start running 10 and 20 lap races, maybe a potential HOC candidate may wish to consider running the one true endurance event on the calender. I will tell you not one racer has been inducted into the HOC that DID NOT run the Blue Water 300. Not a single one.

    And on 2 different occasion, this year and last, the championship was determined at the 300. Maybe there is a ulterior reason for chosing not to make it part of your series points. I don't find it interesting that not a single top CJ competitor entered the enduro, I find it amazing!
    But might justifiably be a REQUIREMENT for the HOC in the ENDURANCE category.

    Keep in mind Jim, those rules were written long before any thought of a SPRINT class would be joining the ENDURANCE category. The CJs USE to be part of inboard. First thing you have to ask yourself is why wasn't the CJs still listed as a inboard class. Why was it ever removed? Ks didn't run for years, yet remained in the book as a class. ETs are still listed as an ENDURANCE class and haven't ran in almost 2 decades. WHY? You have any idea how difficult it is to remove a class. Its almost as hard as introducing one. Yet, CJs were removed from the inboard category!!!! And they were never ever going to get back in.

    Now we have waves, and look at the guy whos making them.

    This topic has been kicked around more than you will EVER KNOW. It is NOT being ignored like you might think. But, their has to be some sort of level field here Jim, and running a 5 lap race in an ENDURANCE class, on top of CHOOSING to NOT run the one true endurance race of the year, just doesn't show me that ANY of the CJs are really interested in running an endurance race.

    We can come up with any number of ways to pick the HOC in the future. First one that comes to mind is the TOTAL points earned in I.E. I am all up for building a CJ!

    OR

    We remove the propulsion requirement for foward mounted v-drive in the GN class and we all run together.



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    Last edited by gn7; 12-24-2011 at 02:33 PM.

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    [QUOTE=gn7;1546876]Jim, just for you information. the 5 mile race rule was, and has been considered for removale long before the CJs joined the category. Its a rediculous rule for the category as was only put in there LONG AGO in the event that there was a time issue and some event and needed to be used and still keep the race a points race.
    It has never once been used in the 11 years I have raced GN. The very shortest race we have ever ran as a points race was 10, and again, due to time restraints.

    Before you even consider whether any of you would like to start running 10 and 20 lap races, maybe a potential HOC candidate may wish to consider running the one true endurance event on the calender. I will tell you not one racer has been inducted into the HOC that DID NOT run the Blue Water 300. Not a single one.

    And on 2 different occasion, this year and last, the championship was determined at the 300. Maybe there is a ulterior reason for chosing not to make it part of your series points. I don't find it interesting that not a single top CJ competitor entered the enduro, I find it amazing!
    But might justifiably be a REQUIREMENT for the HOC in the ENDURANCE category.[/QUOTE/]

    Well if we need to start running 10 lap heats and 20 lap mains to get are commissioner (GN7) to actually respect the fact that more CJ's actually make it on and off the race coarse under are own power, by all means lets do it. I'd like to thank jim for his valid points also, so whats the point of running black lake for the CJ's? and apba and scsc wonder why the cracker's and k's walked away
    Its a FORD thing chevy's arent quick enough to understand

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    All this talk about the 300 should not considered in any respects of the GN's validity of the HOC. Point being that the CJ's get ZERO points for participating in the 300 - why?

    You want to void out CJ participants points/records, then why should the 300 be a considered factor for the HOC for the GN's?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brad @ SCJB View Post
    All this talk about the 300 should not considered in any respects of the GN's validity of the HOC. Point being that the CJ's get ZERO points for participating in the 300 - why?

    You want to void out CJ participants points/records, then why should the 300 be a considered factor for the HOC for the GN's?
    Who told you the CJs get zero point for running them 300? If your not, it by you chosing, not the categories. We (the GNs) made that race a APBA sanctioned GN race. Not the I.E. The CLASS not the category made the 300 a points paying race. Your bitching at the wrong guy(s). You need to look INWARD for the answer to that.

    By the way, this IS NOT the bnest forum in which to discuss this, even among yourselves. And will be the last post I will be making on the subject. But feel free to continue if you think it is.



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    Last edited by gn7; 12-24-2011 at 02:42 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brad @ SCJB View Post
    All this talk about the 300 should not considered in any respects of the GN's validity of the HOC. Point being that the CJ's get ZERO points for participating in the 300 - why?

    You want to void out CJ participants points/records, then why should the 300 be a considered factor for the HOC for the GN's?
    to make a race that a whole whopping 3 legal regular running gn's show upto, to race
    Its a FORD thing chevy's arent quick enough to understand

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