How much HP or torque to make a tunnel run
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How much HP or torque to make a tunnel run

  1. #1
    Senior Member sandeggo's Avatar
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    Default How much HP or torque to make a tunnel run

    Ok so I am a Smallblock guy and just talking to others at the river I have heard multiple times that a smallblock wont make a GW or tunnel run.
    My question is why?
    save the "no replacement for displacement" jive.
    What is required for these boats to get up on the pocket?
    If 400 hp and 400 ft.lbs comes out of a smallblock that is lighter than the bigblock, why won't it work?
    I'm looking at getting a new hull soon, and I love my LS motor. If this motor pushes my heavy V-hull to almost 80, then why wouldn't it push a lighter air entrapment type hull about the same?
    I'm not trying to use this motor in a 21 daytona or break any records or anything. An 18-19 GW or SWTD is what I'm looking at.

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    Senior Member Marcsrollin's Avatar
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    With 400 /400 you would be better off with a gullwing. Everyone I know who has had or has a swtd says they take more horse power than any other hull.
    No matter how good she looks , someone is tired of her shit!

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    Senior Member Futs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcsrollin View Post
    With 400 /400 you would be better off with a gullwing. Everyone I know who has had or has a swtd says they take more horse power than any other hull.
    really? Why?

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    Senior Member EVILFORCE's Avatar
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    Default How much HP or torque to make a tunnel run

    750 hp. Should get you at or slightly over 100.
    No Fool Like A Old Fool is there?

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    Senior Member sandeggo's Avatar
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    I'm not looking to run 100. I am mainly looking to do 80 with a more stable better riding boat.
    I just wanna know why people say this won't work.

  8. #6
    Senior Member sandeggo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Futs View Post
    really? Why?
    I am wondering this as well.

  9. #7
    I do all my own stunts. white tortilla's Avatar
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    i think an 18 gullwing would take less power than a swtd, just because its really more of a v-bottom and u dont have to be packing air to get it out if the water

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    Senior Member Lildave's Avatar
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    You should buy my 16' Mantra Tunnel. It weighs 305lbs bare hull. It ran in the high 80's on gps with about 500hp out of a heavy iron block iron headed bbc. A 400hp ls engine would make the boat move!

  11. #9
    Senior Member bp298's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandeggo View Post
    I'm not looking to run 100. I am mainly looking to do 80 with a more stable better riding boat.
    I just wanna know why people say this won't work.
    when we first got the sw, it was solely used on lakes. used it that way for many summers. it had basically a stock iron headed 454, old tunnel ram with 2 750s. i added an msd ignition just for reliability (and it was).
    over a decade ago, just for grins, we took it to ming and ran river racer just to see what it would do, while the biz was down for a rebuild. just roughly guestimating, the engine was probably making somewhere around 400-425hp. the pump had a stage III mpd blueprint -in 1985-. berk b, and blueprinted dps inducer added about 2 or 3 years before this by jack.

    first pass down the track saturday morning, it ran 13.40/72mph. after the first pass, jack suggested a loaner loader he had, so i tried that by itself (i'd been using a speed grate. i've been running a loader of similar dimensions ever since). jumped from 13.40 to 13.15/76mph. over the weekend, we tried several small changes without changing anything in the drivetrain, adding or removing weight. last pass on sunday, it ran 13.04/78mph. that was the last time that engine ever ran in that boat; it was very tired. if i knew then what i know now, regarding setup of the thing and what it likes, i have no doubt i could have easily gotten it well into the 12s and mid 80s. easily.

    understand, my swtd weighs 700+lbs bare. it is a heavy hull, as most swtd's are. and i had heard all the stories about how swtd's "take more power" to run as fast as other boats. i won't argue the sw against every other boat design when it comes to a gps number. but i have raced against a lot of boats that were lighter with more power (9.50 at the time) and i cannot tell you how many times i've carried those boats to half track. if those boats were the same weight with the same power as i had at the time... well, people can believe whatever they want, but i did it.

    bottom line is this. i have no doubt that you can put your engine in a swtd and run 80 with it. but the pump has to be set up to absorb the power you have, and the boat has to be set up to ride correctly for the power you have. if it's set up to ride like a submarine (which i've had to do intentionally from time to time), it will suck acceleration and speed out of it. if it's set up correctly, to ride on top, you would have no problem hitting 80, and it will accelerate and handle like it should. could be a fun deal...

  12. #10
    Senior Member Marcsrollin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Futs View Post
    really? Why?
    That's just what they told me when I was looking at buying one , maybe they just dident know how to set it up correctly.
    No matter how good she looks , someone is tired of her shit!

  13. #11
    Senior Member sandeggo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by white tortilla View Post
    i think an 18 gullwing would take less power than a swtd, just because its really more of a v-bottom and u dont have to be packing air to get it out if the water
    I see this point, and nice sig grady. too bad I'm tucked back in the bushes in that pic

    Quote Originally Posted by Lildave View Post
    You should buy my 16' Mantra Tunnel. It weighs 305lbs bare hull. It ran in the high 80's on gps with about 500hp out of a heavy iron block iron headed bbc. A 400hp ls engine would make the boat move!
    I need something that won't break in half versus wakeboard boats. And yeah I have thought alot about your boat.

    Quote Originally Posted by bp298 View Post
    when we first got the sw, it was solely used on lakes. used it that way for many summers. it had basically a stock iron headed 454, old tunnel ram with 2 750s. i added an msd ignition just for reliability (and it was).
    over a decade ago, just for grins, we took it to ming and ran river racer just to see what it would do, while the biz was down for a rebuild. just roughly guestimating, the engine was probably making somewhere around 400-425hp. the pump had a stage III mpd blueprint -in 1985-. berk b, and blueprinted dps inducer added about 2 or 3 years before this by jack.

    first pass down the track saturday morning, it ran 13.40/72mph. after the first pass, jack suggested a loaner loader he had, so i tried that by itself (i'd been using a speed grate. i've been running a loader of similar dimensions ever since). jumped from 13.40 to 13.15/76mph. over the weekend, we tried several small changes without changing anything in the drivetrain, adding or removing weight. last pass on sunday, it ran 13.04/78mph. that was the last time that engine ever ran in that boat; it was very tired. if i knew then what i know now, regarding setup of the thing and what it likes, i have no doubt i could have easily gotten it well into the 12s and mid 80s. easily.

    understand, my swtd weighs 700+lbs bare. it is a heavy hull, as most swtd's are. and i had heard all the stories about how swtd's "take more power" to run as fast as other boats. i won't argue the sw against every other boat design when it comes to a gps number. but i have raced against a lot of boats that were lighter with more power (9.50 at the time) and i cannot tell you how many times i've carried those boats to half track. if those boats were the same weight with the same power as i had at the time... well, people can believe whatever they want, but i did it.

    bottom line is this. i have no doubt that you can put your engine in a swtd and run 80 with it. but the pump has to be set up to absorb the power you have, and the boat has to be set up to ride correctly for the power you have. if it's set up to ride like a submarine (which i've had to do intentionally from time to time), it will suck acceleration and speed out of it. if it's set up correctly, to ride on top, you would have no problem hitting 80, and it will accelerate and handle like it should. could be a fun deal...
    Thanks for info. The way I look at it, If this motor pushes my heavy v-hull, how could it not push a lighter hull faster. My boat is only 16' but has a ton of wood in it. Floors, 1-1/8" wood transom, 7/8" thick bottom, has 3 stress cracks on the entire boat from the original gas tank mounts. I have had 4 women dancing on the bow without a problem. Its definately not a light lay up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcsrollin View Post
    That's just what they told me when I was looking at buying one , maybe they just dident know how to set it up correctly.
    Reason I'm posting this thread.
    Last edited by sandeggo; 01-28-2012 at 03:47 PM.

  14. #12
    Senior Member Lildave's Avatar
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    I've crossed paths with 2 wakeboard boats (1 with ballasts full with a wake skater behind) and though it was not a fun ride at all, the boat handled it well structure wise. It's not that great of a lake boat though simply because of how thin the top of the bow is.

  15. #13
    Senior Member bp298's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandeggo View Post
    Thanks for info. The way I look at it, If this motor pushes my heavy v-hull, how could it not push a lighter hull faster. My boat is only 16' but has a ton of wood in it. Floors, 1-1/8" wood transom, 7/8" thick bottom, has 3 stress cracks on the entire boat from the original gas tank mounts. I have had 4 women dancing on the bow without a problem. Its definately not a light lay up.
    the only way to really know how much a hull weighs is to hang it on a scale. otherwise, it's just guessing. not saying it isn't stout. but there's only 1 way to really know what you're comparing.

  16. #14
    Senior Member sandeggo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bp298 View Post
    the only way to really know how much a hull weighs is to hang it on a scale. otherwise, it's just guessing. not saying it isn't stout. but there's only 1 way to really know what you're comparing.
    I watched how much my floor jack screamed when I lifted the bare hull, but I know what ya mean

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