Are COPs stupid or just lazy?
+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 14 of 21

Thread:
Are COPs stupid or just lazy?

  1. #1
    Just Me snoc653's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Eastern Iowa
    Posts
    4,047

    Default Are COPs stupid or just lazy?

    Tonight the wife's house in town was found broken into. So we called the law. The officer shows up, makes a few notes and we pointed out the obvious foot prints in the dust on the front porch (nobody uses the front porch or front door). The steps lead to a window that had been forced open and had clear tread designs in the dust prints. Wife explains what all was stolen, mentions that the thieves moved some stuff and set it down rather than just knocked it over (potentially more prints). COP says he'll write an incident report and tell the detectives and they that they might want to contact her later. I asked if they would need access to check for prints and the COP says it isn't like it is on TV where we can just take prints and put them in a computer and it will tell us who did it, so there really isn't a need to take prints since we don't have a suspect to compare them to. REALLY? I was floored, I told him I understand how prints work as I have a lot of LEO training including a degree so if the detectives didn't want to dust for prints and process the scene, let me know by tomorrow evening as I would process it myself if necessary. I asked him how they could possibly tie a future suspect to the crime if they didn't take the prints now to match them to later (that is provided the thief isn't already in the system). He just said it was really hard to pin old crimes on suspects when they are caught later if they don't still have any of the stolen items.

    So am I overly critical of this officer's skills and knowledge? I haven't mentioned that the whole time I was talking with him, my pistol was holstered on my hip and twice he chose to walk with his back to me, once up a narrow concrete walled stairwell (as in no way to escape). While I'm not a criminal, as a COP I would never turn my back to someone sporting a weapon in plain sight that I didn't know really really well, not even someone as pacifistic as me.
    So many projects, so little time

  2. Remove Advertisements
    PerformanceBoats.com
    Advertisements
     

  3. #2
    The member 1bdhondo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    ca
    Posts
    3,244

    Default

    All your concerns make sense to me
    Sounds like he's pretty lazy. I don't think he was worried about your pistol
    Because he was not worried about you shooting him.

  4. #3
    Senior Member f_inscreenname's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Pasadena, Maryland
    Posts
    1,545

    Default

    I had a car broken into one time (of many) and they cut them selves bad jimmying open the trunk. Big bloody hand print right on top so detailed that it looked like a blown up hand print from a police poster. The cop says, "it could be anyone's print and it's not relevant".
    A winner is just a loser that got up and did it one more time.
    1959 Biesemeyer - 4pt Hydro Drag - 2013 ACBS Winner - Best Race Boat
    1966 Donzi 16
    1967 Nova Marine - SuperNova24 - ACBS Winner - 2012 Best Race Boat - 2016 Peoples Choice & Best Non Wood
    1972 John Allmand - Nova 19
    1982 PolarKraft -Jonboat - Crab Killer

  5. #4
    Senior Member Jake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    3,509

    Default

    In circumstances like this, during the past several years, my thoughts have lead me to assume that it was just too much trouble to actually attempt to resolve the issue. Revelation, what are we paying you for if you don't want to try and do the job but would rather blow smoke up my ass. Pretty hard to argue with the law and they know it.

  6. #5
    Senior Member vdrivenman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    se Texas Cajun Country
    Posts
    466

    Default 2day

    of the agencies that i have worked for field(patrol) officers are not equipped or qualified to lift prints. we do one of several choices. call id tech out,pick up the item and submit for prints. i think there would

    be chain of evidence questions if u print it yourself. there are several programs that do comparisons. not sure what the agencies policy is. sounds a little lax and maybe burned out.

  7. #6
    Just Me snoc653's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Eastern Iowa
    Posts
    4,047

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vdrivenman View Post
    of the agencies that i have worked for field(patrol) officers are not equipped or qualified to lift prints. we do one of several choices. call id tech out,pick up the item and submit for prints. i think there would

    be chain of evidence questions if u print it yourself. there are several programs that do comparisons. not sure what the agencies policy is. sounds a little lax and maybe burned out.
    I agree 100%. I will only process the scene myself if the detectives don't show or call today. And while any prints I get won't be admissible, I will be able to compare them against a person of interest identified by the neighbors. No the officer didn't have time to talk to them either and they were standing outside so he could (at my request so he could get the person's info). Apparently the officer thinks detectives are responsible for canvassing the neighborhood. And while patrol units aren't usually equipped to take prints they do usually have a small camera which would have been something. Todays rain could deteriorate the outside forensics even though they are under a covered porch.

    I really hope they step up and start doing police work the way it is taught. Lazy cops annoy me.
    So many projects, so little time

  8. #7
    Floatin dirty Lavey29's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    4,831

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by snoc653 View Post
    Tonight the wife's house in town was found broken into. So we called the law. The officer shows up, makes a few notes and we pointed out the obvious foot prints in the dust on the front porch (nobody uses the front porch or front door). The steps lead to a window that had been forced open and had clear tread designs in the dust prints. Wife explains what all was stolen, mentions that the thieves moved some stuff and set it down rather than just knocked it over (potentially more prints). COP says he'll write an incident report and tell the detectives and they that they might want to contact her later. I asked if they would need access to check for prints and the COP says it isn't like it is on TV where we can just take prints and put them in a computer and it will tell us who did it, so there really isn't a need to take prints since we don't have a suspect to compare them to. REALLY? I was floored, I told him I understand how prints work as I have a lot of LEO training including a degree so if the detectives didn't want to dust for prints and process the scene, let me know by tomorrow evening as I would process it myself if necessary. I asked him how they could possibly tie a future suspect to the crime if they didn't take the prints now to match them to later (that is provided the thief isn't already in the system). He just said it was really hard to pin old crimes on suspects when they are caught later if they don't still have any of the stolen items.

    So am I overly critical of this officer's skills and knowledge? I haven't mentioned that the whole time I was talking with him, my pistol was holstered on my hip and twice he chose to walk with his back to me, once up a narrow concrete walled stairwell (as in no way to escape). While I'm not a criminal, as a COP I would never turn my back to someone sporting a weapon in plain sight that I didn't know really really well, not even someone as pacifistic as me.


    I can only give you a perspective from southern California area. As I supervise the CSI section of the crime lab which is an internationally accredited facility. Property crimes as you describe are not given as much attention typically due to the backlog of evidence relating to violent crimes. Dusting for prints is typically done but getting results back identifying someone is time consuming and not like on TV. The computer database does not just pop up a direct match. It gives you a group or maybe 50 similar matches and then you have to try and systematically work your way through to see if any direct match hits. As far as shoe prints in dust well they might photograph that and then if some one is ID'd maybe from the fingerprints then they could perhaps obtain a warrant to look for shoes that match. Remember how they photo'd OJ's shoe prints in blood and then matched those to a pair of unique expensive shoes that he owned in his size. They had photos of him wearing the shoes during football shows but strangely could not find those shoes during the search. I worked as a detective for many years when I was younger and typically wold get results (if any) from fingerprints 6 months to 1.5 years after the event (property type crime) due to the backlog of casework.

  9. #8
    Senior Member Uncle Dave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    2,989

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by snoc653 View Post
    Tonight the wife's house in town was found broken into. So we called the law. The officer shows up, makes a few notes and we pointed out the obvious foot prints in the dust on the front porch (nobody uses the front porch or front door). The steps lead to a window that had been forced open and had clear tread designs in the dust prints. Wife explains what all was stolen, mentions that the thieves moved some stuff and set it down rather than just knocked it over (potentially more prints). COP says he'll write an incident report and tell the detectives and they that they might want to contact her later. I asked if they would need access to check for prints and the COP says it isn't like it is on TV where we can just take prints and put them in a computer and it will tell us who did it, so there really isn't a need to take prints since we don't have a suspect to compare them to. REALLY? I was floored, I told him I understand how prints work as I have a lot of LEO training including a degree so if the detectives didn't want to dust for prints and process the scene, let me know by tomorrow evening as I would process it myself if necessary. I asked him how they could possibly tie a future suspect to the crime if they didn't take the prints now to match them to later (that is provided the thief isn't already in the system). He just said it was really hard to pin old crimes on suspects when they are caught later if they don't still have any of the stolen items.

    So am I overly critical of this officer's skills and knowledge? I haven't mentioned that the whole time I was talking with him, my pistol was holstered on my hip and twice he chose to walk with his back to me, once up a narrow concrete walled stairwell (as in no way to escape). While I'm not a criminal, as a COP I would never turn my back to someone sporting a weapon in plain sight that I didn't know really really well, not even someone as pacifistic as me.

    Probably neither lazy, nor stupid.

    He's been "informed about how he feels about your situation" from above and put out the level of effort he was directed to. Break in Burglary- not much.

    I had my home broken into and was basically cleaned out while I was out of town and the local guys in blue exhibited about the same level of enthusiasm.

    When 20 homes were broken into in a 5 block radius the guys in the offices got involved.
    If you want the guys in blue to do the legwork the guys in the office need to tell them to.


    UD

  10. #9
    Senior Member Uncle Dave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    2,989

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lavey29 View Post
    I can only give you a perspective from southern California area. As I supervise the CSI section of the crime lab which is an internationally accredited facility. Property crimes as you describe are not given as much attention typically due to the backlog of evidence relating to violent crimes. Dusting for prints is typically done but getting results back identifying someone is time consuming and not like on TV. The computer database does not just pop up a direct match. It gives you a group or maybe 50 similar matches and then you have to try and systematically work your way through to see if any direct match hits. As far as shoe prints in dust well they might photograph that and then if some one is ID'd maybe from the fingerprints then they could perhaps obtain a warrant to look for shoes that match. Remember how they photo'd OJ's shoe prints in blood and then matched those to a pair of unique expensive shoes that he owned in his size. They had photos of him wearing the shoes during football shows but strangely could not find those shoes during the search. I worked as a detective for many years when I was younger and typically wold get results (if any) from fingerprints 6 months to 1.5 years after the event (property type crime) due to the backlog of casework.
    Yup.

    CSI and police shows in general give people the impression that you can do 8 months of lab work in 22 minutes.

    As you mentioned the turnaround isn't instant.

    Uncle Dave

  11. #10
    Just Me snoc653's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Eastern Iowa
    Posts
    4,047

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Dave View Post
    Probably neither lazy, nor stupid.

    He's been "informed about how he feels about your situation" from above and put out the level of effort he was directed to. Break in Burglary- not much.

    I had my home broken into and was basically cleaned out while I was out of town and the local guys in blue exhibited about the same level of enthusiasm.

    When 20 homes were broken into in a 5 block radius the guys in the offices got involved.
    If you want the guys in blue to do the legwork the guys in the office need to tell them to.


    UD
    Apathetic is probably a better description and you are right it is a trickle down attitude. However, telling them if they won't I will apparently had some sway as the detectives are actually working the case now and pulling what prints they can. They are also talking to the neighbors, who I informed them had a good description of a suspect. While I doubt we will recover any of the items, it would be nice to at least make a small step in ridding some of the crime. Who knows how many cases one good one might actually clear up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Dave View Post
    Yup.

    CSI and police shows in general give people the impression that you can do 8 months of lab work in 22 minutes.

    As you mentioned the turnaround isn't instant.

    Uncle Dave
    True, it isn't a half hour show where they take fingerprints today and in less than 30 min the criminal is locked up. But, while the officer pointed out that taking prints do no good if you don't have a suspect to compare them to, having a suspect and not having taken the prints in the first place leaves them with nothing. And all booked individuals have their prints taken and entered into the national database. So if you have a list of possible suspects and good prints from the crime scene to run against them, it is more likely to get results. In this case, every day that passes is one more day for the trail of stolen goods to go cold and become unreliably traceable for court purposes.

    The true victory for me was getting the PD to at least go thru the motions to settle the wife's fears. Protect and serve doesn't mean catch every bad guy every time. But, taking the investigation seriously and giving the victim peace of mind is definitely part of the job and our PD needs to start acting like they understand that.
    Last edited by snoc653; 08-19-2014 at 11:07 PM.
    So many projects, so little time

  12. #11
    Senior Member Uncle Dave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    2,989

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by snoc653 View Post
    Apathetic is probably a better description and you are right it is a trickle down attitude. However, telling them if they won't I will apparently had some sway as the detectives are actually working the case now and pulling what prints they can. They are also talking to the neighbors, who I informed them had a good description of a suspect. While I doubt we will recover any of the items, it would be nice to at least make a small step in ridding some of the crime. Who knows how many cases one good one might actually clear up.



    True, it isn't a half hour show where they take fingerprints today and in less than 30 min the criminal is locked up. But, while the officer pointed out that taking prints do no good if you don't have a suspect to compare them to, having a suspect and not having taken the prints in the first place leaves them with nothing. And all booked individuals have their prints taken and entered into the national database. So if you have a list of possible suspects and good prints from the crime scene to run against them, it is more likely to get results. In this case, every day that passes is one more day for the trail of stolen goods to go cold and become unreliably traceable for court purposes.

    The true victory for me was getting the PD to at least go thru the motions to settle the wife's fears. Protect and serve doesn't mean catch every bad guy every time. But, taking the investigation seriously and giving the victim peace of mind is definitely part of the job and our PD needs to start acting like they understand that.

    The irony of the officers statement about getting prints to match against did not slip by me.

    I was basically told that same story - in addition to that to insist was a waste of time and that he wasn't going to push it on my behalf.

    I just chalked it up to the the fact that burglaries where no one gets hurt, murdered or held hostage by and large don't get much attention.

    Calming the Mrs. down is a big deal glad that worked out. My friends that are cops all understand " the bonnie situation".

    UD

  13. #12
    Colts fan & Stoker owner RitcheyRch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Santa Clarita Valley
    Posts
    8,170

    Default

    My car was stolen and recovered many years ago. The cops said they wouldn't take prints because the car was not used in a crime as far as they knew. Isn't stealing a car a crime.


    Quote Originally Posted by f_inscreenname View Post
    I had a car broken into one time (of many) and they cut them selves bad jimmying open the trunk. Big bloody hand print right on top so detailed that it looked like a blown up hand print from a police poster. The cop says, "it could be anyone's print and it's not relevant".
    www.facebook.com/RitcheyRch

    "I didn't pay them for sex, I paid them to leave"
    Charlie Sheen

    Life is all about ass, you're either covering it, hauling it, laughing it off, kicking it, kissing it, busting it, trying to get a piece of it, or behaving like one.

  14. #13
    Senior Member W.O.T's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Campo Ca
    Posts
    988

    Default

    Another situation I had surprised me. Very minor but The lady's car got rear ended yesterday.
    The other driver had no drivers license or insurance. I called the local PD dispatch and they did not want to respond. I just assumed they wouldn't want this guy just driving off.

  15. #14
    Floatin dirty Lavey29's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    4,831

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RitcheyRch View Post
    My car was stolen and recovered many years ago. The cops said they wouldn't take prints because the car was not used in a crime as far as they knew. Isn't stealing a car a crime.

    It is because the District Attorneys office will not file charges on someone just for GTA based on prints in the car. Someone actually has to see the person ion the stolen car such as a witness or the cops. Now if the car is used to commit a robbery or some other violent crime then the DA office considers print evidence found in the stolen car. Makes no sense to me but that is how they operate.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Quick Reply Quick Reply

Register Now

Please enter the name by which you would like to log-in and be known on this site.

Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Please select your insurance company (Optional)

Log-in

Tags for this Thread

Digg This Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
 

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95