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Discussion Starter #1
I am just about ready to assemble my new motor and was curious to see what others thought about the felpro wire lock gaskets . In the past I used o ringed copper but it seem most guys are using MLS gaskets . When I purchased the wire lock gaskets I was unaware the the heads need to be machined so the reality is that I saved nothing by using these over o ringed copper.
 

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Here is total what I know:
I always O ringed the block and never the heads. I found the best sealing was sticking the O ring .020 up. I know some guys are gonna fall over reading that but it is true.
Blown alcohol I would never consider a MLS gasket. But that is just me.
Now I have 2 blown gassers running the Fel Pro MLS gasket and no issues at all.
In fact never had a head gasket problem of any kind.

I am not familiar with this wire lock gasket. I will read up tho.
 

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"Loc Wire head gaskets require machining a special receiver groove into the cylinder heads by a skilled machinist. Complete instructions are provided with each gasket."

Ok now I got ya. Damn if I would do that. Might as well do O ring and copper if that is the case. Everyone's bitch with copper has been sealing the water.
I don't know if it is luck or what....but I clean all surfaces with lacquer thinner, let it dry.....then apply ONLY...Permatex Ultra Blue Silicone seal around anywhere there is water. Apply to block....then put head gasket on...then apply to head gasket...then install head.
NOT Ultra black...or ultra grey....although I have no idea why..but when I use that stuff I get leaks.
Works for me.
 

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o'ring and reciever groove heads, run the flatout RCC copper gasket with the coating, they never leak water period...best gasket I have ever found. the coating is a silcone/rubber stuff that will not come off and seals every nook and cranny of the deck surface. pops right off reuseable..ect ect..

copper oring reciever groove combo will hold ANY boost you can put to the motor until the clampload of the studs give up. Before this gasket I panograph cut rubber o ring grooves around the water passages in the head and the block,thus every water port had a total seal aganist the copper gasket on both sides. Major pita tho. flatout rcc gasket ended this process. the felpro 1093 is also a very very good gasket in mild boost apps as well. MLS ? eh dont like um..imho
 

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I tell ya fiat the rcc is a amazing gasket..after ya torque it down you can see a little "bead" of the coating squished out all around the edges..take it off and it goes back the way it was. I've run 1093 at 18 psi gas with zero issues on bowtie or dart blocks,but copper is best.
 

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Word of caution about the LOCK WIRE Felpros. Once you cut the head for them, it a done deal. You have to keep running those gaskets. They will hold back damn near anything. The Outlaw 5.0 guys love em. they are in fact an o-ring gasket. But you are stuck with them for life. The groove is the wrong size and depth for regular o-ring wire. And it requires a machine shop with a BHJ ring jig that is dedicated to cutting the groove for those gaskets. And the gasket isn't cheap. Just be aware.



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Highaboosta
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Always used solid copper gaskets. No Orings, the cylinder liner sticks above the deck .005 and embeds in the copper. Never had a problem even at 30# boost.

High temp silicone around the water ports and it has worked great for me.
 

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I tell ya fiat the rcc is a amazing gasket..after ya torque it down you can see a little "bead" of the coating squished out all around the edges..take it off and it goes back the way it was. I've run 1093 at 18 psi gas with zero issues on bowtie or dart blocks,but copper is best.
I will try those. I knew someone made a copper with a silicone bead on the gasket (which I was told did not work) but was not aware of these.
 

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Always used solid copper gaskets. No Orings, the cylinder liner sticks above the deck .005 and embeds in the copper. Never had a problem even at 30# boost.

High temp silicone around the water ports and it has worked great for me.
Somebody else on here, can't remeber who, was dead set against Cometics. Could never get them to seal, leaked water, etc etc. Only ran copper heads gaskets with no o-rings. Turned out to be a Kieth Black alumn block with the liners protruding above the deck. That along with Cometics do not mix



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I have and do run copper. I have and do run Cometic.
My opinion is as follows:
Copper
PROS: Tried, tested, proven for years and years. No offense to anyone, but the heads and block should be cut for o-rings and receiver grooves. Again, this is the tested and proven method for whatever boost you want. Silicone around the water ports, and they seal great.
CONS: Once you cut for o-rings and receiver grooves, you are pretty much stuck with that setup for the life of the engine. You could deck the o-ring out, but you end up with a short deck, or cutting the grooves out of the heads is also possible. This is only about .020. But does take some life out of the heads. Also, when you mill the heads, groves should be touched up, or need to sleeve a cylinder, it is a PITA to match stuff up. Not impossible, just makes your machinist cuss. Also, you will spend another 200 to 300 bucks to machine for o-rings and receiver groves.

Cometic
PROS: Also tested and proven for quite a few years. Does not require any special machining to install.
CONS: Will not handle the boost copper will handle. They are more than adequit for most applications. They can be tricky to get to seal at times. Usually a surface finish function. Silicone on rail ends helps.

Both "are reuseable". I reuse copper. I don't reuse cometic. Cost is about the same (for gaskets). To each is own.
Both are excellent when properly installed and used.
Wags
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Thanks for the input. I think Im just gonna send the wire lock back and just do what I know works ,O ringed copper . You know I just dont know what felpro was thinking . Trying to reinvent the wheel with the same amount of effort. Nothing gained.
 

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Thanks for the input. I think Im just gonna send the wire lock back and just do what I know works ,O ringed copper . You know I just dont know what felpro was thinking . Trying to reinvent the wheel with the same amount of effort. Nothing gained.
Back when I was building we used copper gaskets with shelac (tabors) but this was 35 years ago, they would run about a season but the shelac hardens up and once and a while you would push a gasket, there are alot better things out there to use now.
 

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Just pulled a blown 509 apart, 15# bost, 6000rpm, ~900-950hp. Cometics looked great around the water passages and no sign of combustion leaking anywhere. I think they sealed up great, but there was a lot of oil on both sides of the gaskets. Next time they'll get a coat of Coppercoat. Surfaces on block and heads were fresh machined, and machined correctly. To add: the block has o-ring grooves but no wire. I've run blocks like this before with no ill effect, and know of guys that used to do it intentionally. Kind of the reverse effect of the wire, especially with a copper gasket. Definitely gives the gasket something to bite into.
 

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I've had great luck with both. I ran cometics in n.a. stuff to well over 1,700 and would reuse them after every rebuild (35) runs. just wash the copper coat off in the wash tank with mineral sports and scotchbrite (used up ones) by hand then spray with copper coat and reuse. I would use them untill the gray would start coming off between cylinders. with the correct tune up cometics work well to 1400 with a blower and 1600 with a Turbo.anything over should get copper.
 

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PASO ROBLES CA
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I am getting ready to bolt the heads back on my blown BBC. The block is o-ringed and i am planning on re using the copper head gaskets.I will silicone around all water ports with blue permatex .I have not heard anybody (Anneal) the copper to soften it up.I personally have not done this before, but sounds like a good idea to soften the gasket some.Is it worth the trouble?
 

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building or should i say rebuilding my blown 540. always used cometic mls gaskets and loved them, but was thinking of using the isc titan copper head gasket with a o-ring already in the gasket. any thoughts.:)hand
trevor
 
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