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29812
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Discussion Starter #1
About Teachers, Policemen, Firemen, hell Government workers low pay and decent benefits...

Now that everyone is out of a job, it is suddenly ALL of THEIR faults...

People are amazing.
Carry on!
 

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Administrator
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I remember in 2004 when real estate was the never ending utopia of money for nothing and stated income loans were like going through the fast food line at McDonalds.

I guess the slight flattening of the market around 2007-2008 that most experts predicted is now in process. :)eh:)


Perhaps I misunderstood and they meant flat lining. :dunno: :buddies:
 

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Red Blooded American
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Are you saying there is no need for belt tightening? Are you aware that everyone you mentioned receives their funding from tax dollars, which are lower in receipt than this country has had in years?
If so, your head is in the sand and you need to take a peek at the reality that without deep cuts, our government institutions won't be funded at all shortly.
 

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About Teachers, Policemen, Firemen, hell Government workers low pay and decent benefits...

Now that everyone is out of a job, it is suddenly ALL of THEIR faults...

People are amazing.
Carry on!
Killer, Im sorry on behalf of others that have made stinging comments about LEOs and such... I know that has to hurt...

Fact remains that when a municipality or a county or a state is being told to get the financial house in order by the resounding voice of the voters what do you do??? Go back to the lemon and squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeze out a few more drops??? At some point cuts must be made to balance the budget, it has to happen...

You and I can't spend more than we bring home without severe consequences... It really is as simple as that... First Wisconsin made the news, now NYC, and there will be more and more... The States/cities/counties MUST get their checkbook in order... Throw all the BS that is getting spewed around out the window...

Again, I'm sorry for the people that have made hurtful comments about LEOs and other public servants that are trying to keep things safe/nice/clean...

Bruce.....


I remember in 2004 when real estate was the never ending utopia of money for nothing and stated income loans were like going through the fast food line at McDonalds.

I guess the slight flattening of the market around 2007-2008 that most experts predicted is now in process. :)eh:)


Perhaps I misunderstood and they meant flat lining. :dunno: :buddies:
Rexie, Rexie, Rexie... All the time that I had the Sept. 1999 WSJ link in my siggy and you never read it??? :D

Your just joshin with us, I know u are... ;)

"In moving, even tentatively, into this new area of lending, Fannie Mae is taking on significantly more risk, which may not pose any difficulties during flush economic times. But the government-subsidized corporation may run into trouble in an economic downturn, prompting a government rescue similar to that of the savings and loan industry in the 1980's.

''From the perspective of many people, including me, this is another thrift industry growing up around us,'' said Peter Wallison a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute. ''If they fail, the government will have to step up and bail them out the way it stepped up and bailed out the thrift industry.''"



http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C0DE7DB153EF933A0575AC0A96F958260&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=1
 

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29812
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Discussion Starter #5
Police, fire and teachers are way underpaid . For you to think otherwise . You might wanna pull your head out of the sand
 

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Agreed. I definitely think bargaining units can take acceptable cuts like everyone else, but to fully attack them is a bit of a shotgun approach. All agencies have different avenues from which their budgets travel. Not everyone is tax-funded.

The other side to it is - if people are jealous about wages and benefits - they should have applied and taken the test(s) required to get into one of those careers. Don't go crying just because you CHOSE a career that get paid less or has worse benefits.
 

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Premium Member
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Are you saying there is no need for belt tightening? Are you aware that everyone you mentioned receives their funding from tax dollars, which are lower in receipt than this country has had in years?
If so, your head is in the sand and you need to take a peek at the reality that without deep cuts, our government institutions won't be funded at all shortly.
There is a definite need for belt tightening. For example; I was given a Blackberry about four years ago. Two years later I was told that I was getting a new one (as was everyone else in my department). There was nothing wrong with the old one. I didn't want a new one. I got one. Where is the old one ? Sitting in my desk for the last two years along with 500 others. I for one am getting damn tired of watching this kind of waste and then being blamed for the financial ills of the state.

We went on furloughs two years ago and since then hired several more people and we're still on furloughs.
 

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Agreed. I definitely think bargaining units can take acceptable cuts like everyone else, but to fully attack them is a bit of a shotgun approach. All agencies have different avenues from which their budgets travel. Not everyone is tax-funded.

The other side to it is - if people are jealous about wages and benefits - they should have applied and taken the test(s) required to get into one of those careers. Don't go crying just because you CHOSE a career that get paid less or has worse benefits.
Your comment here clearly shows that your STILL not getting it... Jealous/not jealous/crying/not crying/paid more/paid less put it all aside... THE BUDGETS MUST BE CUT AND BALANCED... IT'S THAT SIMPLE...

Without a doubt teachers are important, without a doubt teachers salaries are all over the place and many/most don't pull down big $$$... I think that the superintendent/assistant superintendent/assistant to the assistant and so on need to be under the bright light...

Do schools still need golf,soccer,football,tennis,swimming,water polo,diving,track,fencing,baseball,softball,wrestling,pingpong,PomPom,cheerleading,flags/color guard,etc,etc,etc at all levels from JH up through highschool for boys and for girls and a special league for the students that are confused about their gender??? Is all of this necessary to provide a solid education??? And trips to Paris France or the Islands in the Gulf???

I know I'm gonna draw some fire on this one by calling out the EC activities but cuts are necessary and the check book is in the red, whatcha gonna do??? I wrestled/played football/baseball, I know it's FUN but EDUCATION is the focus...
 

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Your comment here clearly shows that your STILL not getting it... Jealous/not jealous/crying/not crying/paid more/paid less put it all aside... THE BUDGETS MUST BE CUT AND BALANCED... IT'S THAT SIMPLE...

Without a doubt teachers are important, without a doubt teachers salaries are all over the place and many/most don't pull down big $$$... I think that the superintendent/assistant superintendent/assistant to the assistant and so on need to be under the bright light...

Do schools still need golf,soccer,football,tennis,swimming,water polo,diving,track,fencing,baseball,softball,wrestling,pingpong,PomPom,cheerleading,flags/color guard,etc,etc,etc at all levels from JH up through highschool for boys and for girls and a special league for the students that are confused about their gender??? Is all of this necessary to provide a solid education??? And trips to Paris France or the Islands in the Gulf???

I know I'm gonna draw some fire on this one by calling out the EC activities but cuts are necessary and the check book is in the red, whatcha gonna do??? I wrestled/played football/baseball, I know it's FUN but EDUCATION is the focus...
No, no. I said I agree that there should be cuts - whether temporary or not.

My point, in general terms, is that people should not just go head-hunting just because some groups make alot more money than them. There should be cuts across the board, but not complete ridicule.

More closely - people that scream about millionaires needing to pay MORE than their share of taxes. My point being - ANYONE can be a millionaire, if they CHOOSE to.

Or, for instance, if a teacher gripes and complains about a cop or fireman making thousands more than them AND having better benefits to boot - the teacher is just being jealous. I agree everyone needs to pitch in or it will ALL go way, regardless of career. There just seems to be a lot of people targeting the careers that they DIDN'T CHOOSE. ANYONE can be a Trump, if they CHOOSE.
 

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During the haydays of rising property , low unemployment etc. The citizens were all making lots of money, the cities had an abundance of cash and things were good. They were so good that we all wanted to reward our poilce, fire and city/Govt workers with good pay increases, the wealth was being shared.

I am not going to bag on the police and fire for it being their fault. It was no ones fault. But now the belt tightening has to come, We do not make the money to pay these wages anymore. I am the first who would love to give police and Fire another raise, provide we could become prosperous enough to afford it. WE can't pay what we don't have.

My 25 year old son is a Police officer. He has been on the force for 4 years. Besides the good medical, pension and other benefits. He works 3 12's one week and 4 12's the next. A great job with great time off. Last year his W-2 was $102,450.00, he did work some overtime, but I mean..................., come on now............. I am truly happy and proud for him and do not want for him to take a pay cut, as his father. But as a citizen that has had a pay cut of over 80% from the big days I think we all need to chip in.

Not only police and fire, but EVERYONE. Why does only the private sector have to tighten their belt.
 

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No, no. I said I agree that there should be cuts - whether temporary or not.

My point, in general terms, is that people should not just go head-hunting just because some groups make alot more money than them. There should be cuts across the board, but not complete ridicule.

More closely - people that scream about millionaires needing to pay MORE than their share of taxes. My point being - ANYONE can be a millionaire, if they CHOOSE to.

Or, for instance, if a teacher gripes and complains about a cop or fireman making thousands more than them AND having better benefits to boot - the teacher is just being jealous. I agree everyone needs to pitch in or it will ALL go way, regardless of career. There just seems to be a lot of people targeting the careers that they DIDN'T CHOOSE. ANYONE can be a Trump, if they CHOOSE.
Ok, cool, we agree... :)

I missed that...

People need to focus on the issue NOT what the left/right/up/down/top/bottom is saying... And the issue is that PAINFUL cuts are going to be made, it has to happen...

I LOVE our PBS stations (all four of them) and love most of the programming, if the NEA and all sorts of other endowments have to experience big cuts the people that watch PBS can double down/tripple down to support the programming they want but the Federal/State/Local Govt. has to get it's ducks in a row, end of story...

Despite what people think I am listening to NPR radio 98% of the time and really enjoy the programming, if they have to endure massive cuts in endowments I will double/tripple down to do my part and support them...

Bruce...
 

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Ok, cool, we agree... :)

I missed that...

People need to focus on the issue NOT what the left/right/up/down/top/bottom is saying... And the issue is that PAINFUL cuts are going to be made, it has to happen...
There you have it. When there is no money it must happen. It can be voluntary or it can be otherwise when many may lose a lot more than if it had been voluntary.

2mm no I didn't miss the link. I just posted that for Kilr's benefit because we both always used to be in amazement at the real estate mindset back then on Hotboat. But back to the topic, cuts are going to happen because the government has no money (for lots of reasons).

I'm going to move this thread now because it has taken an unavoidable direction to political/government. But by all means continue...
 

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Police, fire and teachers are way underpaid . For you to think otherwise . You might wanna pull your head out of the sand
Sad... Don't like it.. Get another job. Waterproofing contractors are underpayed, care to chip in?? :)bulb
 

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There you have it. When there is no money it must happen. It can be voluntary or it can be otherwise when many may lose a lot more than if it had been voluntary.

2mm no I didn't miss the link. I just posted that for Kilr's benefit because we both always used to be in amazement at the real estate mindset back then on Hotboat. But back to the topic, cuts are going to happen because the government has no money (for lots of reasons).

I'm going to move this thread now because it has taken an unavoidable direction to political/government. But by all means continue...
I was just messin wit ya on the WSJ dealio... ;)

Unfortunately I can't continue now... :(
 

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Police, fire and teachers are way underpaid . For you to think otherwise . You might wanna pull your head out of the sand
This coming from a guy who once said (paraphrased) that he could make more money in the private sector but chose public service for the benefits, particularly the retirement. It struck a cord with me when I read it. I thought whats this guy & guys like him going to do when the public refuses to pay his retirement?

$60 - $250K isn't what most would consider underpaid for public service IMO.
 

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The areas that I feel there could be cuts are mostly mandated by the feds. We have to have "coaches" which are teachers (on teachers' salaries) whose sole job is to show "experienced" teachers how to teach the kind of instruction that the hired contractor says we have to use. If we could ditch the stupid contractor, we'd have a lot more money. I'd guess our district pays these folks (Action Learning Services -ALS) hundreds of thousands. Plus, about 10-12 teachers have to leave their classrooms once a month to spend all day in these meetings to learn how to teach this new style and take it back to their departments. So that's 10-12 subs per site/per month. Oh, and they feed us catered meals for these trainings. Now, personally, I'd rather spend all day in the dentist chair than attend these things. I feel they are a huge waste of time and all I do is think of all the work I could be doing, or worry about my kids with a sub. If I'm going to be out at a training, I'd rather be getting material I can use for my subject area. But there isn't any money for me to go to a Social Studies conference.

When we have our monthly staff meeting and minimum day, do we really need to feed everyone? What do they eat every other day? Admin picks up the tab. New t-shirts for the staff to get the kids excited for CST testing? We got new shirts last year for the same thing. I still have mine. Why do we need another? These things piss me off.

Salaries? I don't know a single teacher who is rich. Most make 50-70K. Some make less, some make more. Of course, that's CA wages. Most states make less.
 

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Even in the best of times the cities, state and fed government were spending and promising pay, pensions and benefits and all other services, and hiring like crazy. That could not be supported by the tax paying citizens.
Sorry, for any one that has had to take a cut, but that is reality. The private sector got hammered and always has. Our business is off 40%-50%. Is your pay check off 40% in the public sector? In the private sector you just have to find different ways to make it and work that much harder. There isn't a week that goes by that 80-100hrs isn't normal. What you think Killer isn't good pay most in the private sector think it is. Then throw benefits on top of it. All coming out of the private sector. Please, don't tell us about your lousy paycheck you think you get.
 

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Even in the best of times the cities, state and fed government were spending and promising pay, pensions and benefits and all other services, and hiring like crazy. That could not be supported by the tax paying citizens.
Sorry, for any one that has had to take a cut, but that is reality. The private sector got hammered and always has. Our business is off 40%-50%. Is your pay check off 40% in the public sector? In the private sector you just have to find different ways to make it and work that much harder. There isn't a week that goes by that 80-100hrs isn't normal. What you think Killer isn't good pay most in the private sector think it is. Then throw benefits on top of it. All coming out of the private sector. Please, don't tell us about your lousy paycheck you think you get.

At least you have a job and getting a paycheck. I can assure you it is not so great out here in the Real World.
 
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