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v drive rookie
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi all, first off, I'm new here. Wanted to post up a couple of pics showing off the new toy! This will be my first v drive, have had a number of fast outboards, one jet, can't wait to run this one. As far as I know, it's a 454 with an Art Carr trans. Casale v, etc...you guys could probably tell me more from the pics :) I did have a couple of questions:

- The cav plate adjustment motor is gone...just some plates and a hole in the transom. How critical will it be to get this sorted out before I run it? I'm anticipating that the cav plates on a boat like this are a bit more "optional" trim than they are on your more radical hot rod flats
- Anyone have experience with this hull? What should I expect speed wise out of a relatively mild BBC / v drive?
- Anything I should give a once over before I go get 'er wet?

Thanks!
- Rick
 

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Very nice piece ya got there. If it were me I would fix the plates before you take it out. I also would consider installing a manual handle instead of an electric motor but that is just me. I have had them both ways and the manual is better IMHO... As far as speed goes it all depends on what kind of BSer that you are:wink2: I had a 22' Schiada with a stock 454 and it ran 65 MPH. YRMV...

Steve
 

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Any safety collars on the rudder and propshaft? Look for a collar on the prop shaft either just ahead of the strut of better, between the v-drive and the shaft log, or better yet, one each place. On the rudder, look at the key-way and how the rudder is held up from falling out of the hole.....is there something there to prevent that motion.

All bolts should have a wrench put to them before running the boat.......u-joints, motor mounts, trans mounts, v-drive mounts, seat mounts, steering cable attachments, fuel tanks, water lines, manifolds.....get the idea?

Since you have no way to keep the cav plates from moving either direction, I'd figure that out before launching.....you don't want them to suck down and dip the nose at speed, at minimum I'd stabilize them into a flat to the the bottom configuration but that really time and money wasted. Do it right the first time, either electric motor and push/pull rod or manual cav controls.

Report back!

Nice floater!
 

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In addition to what was said above. Is that motor fully covered? If So, I would be careful with those WATER INJECTED headers. They get hot at idle. I have them on my jet, but am going back to logs, then eventually water jacketed headers. My motor is getting covered this year for the girls.

Nice toy.
 

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v drive rookie
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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
In addition to what was said above. Is that motor fully covered? If So, I would be careful with those WATER INJECTED headers. They get hot at idle. I have them on my jet, but am going back to logs, then eventually water jacketed headers. My motor is getting covered this year for the girls.

Nice toy.
Thanks! The previous owner had just put those on. I've got the old cover / seats that go back there but they don't fit with the new headers. I'd much prefer the jacketed ones too, I had a jet with Bassett over the transoms and they were plenty hot...the girls were not too fond of that :)grn

Any safety collars on the rudder and propshaft? Look for a collar on the prop shaft either just ahead of the strut of better, between the v-drive and the shaft log, or better yet, one each place. On the rudder, look at the key-way and how the rudder is held up from falling out of the hole.....is there something there to prevent that motion.

All bolts should have a wrench put to them before running the boat.......u-joints, motor mounts, trans mounts, v-drive mounts, seat mounts, steering cable attachments, fuel tanks, water lines, manifolds.....get the idea?

Since you have no way to keep the cav plates from moving either direction, I'd figure that out before launching.....you don't want them to suck down and dip the nose at speed, at minimum I'd stabilize them into a flat to the the bottom configuration but that really time and money wasted. Do it right the first time, either electric motor and push/pull rod or manual cav controls.

Report back!

Nice floater!
Thanks, will do! I'll start poking around looking for these safety collars. Since this is my first v drive I've got an idea in my head as to what / where you're describing but can't say I know exactly what I'm looking for. Same goes for the rudder and it's key-way. Off to google for some pictures. Regarding the cav plates, you nailed my concern. That said, for a boat that'll be lucky to hit 65mph (thanks for the guess Roaddogg), is that sucking down and unwanted trim change possible? It certainly makes sense to me that you wouldn't want those things loose back there at speed. Where's a good spot to look into everything needed to rig those up with manual controls? I'm sure Rex Marine has a few things...I'd need the entire linkage, whatever seals that to the transom, controls, etc. Another thought there, does anyone run these as a second (single) pedal that pushes down only?

Very nice piece ya got there. If it were me I would fix the plates before you take it out. I also would consider installing a manual handle instead of an electric motor but that is just me. I have had them both ways and the manual is better IMHO... As far as speed goes it all depends on what kind of BSer that you are:wink2: I had a 22' Schiada with a stock 454 and it ran 65 MPH. YRMV...

Steve
Thanks Steve, sounds like that's the consensus - get them fixed up first. As for speed 65 would be plenty for me until I get to know the boat. I'm sure the "faster" bug will bite shortly though :|err

UPDATE - Found this thread with some good info on the safety items, starting to make a lot more sense to this rookie:
http://www.performanceboats.com/v-drives/1008-v-drive-hardware-safety.html
 

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UPDATE - Found this thread with some good info on the safety items, starting to make a lot more sense to this rookie:
http://www.performanceboats.com/v-drives/1008-v-drive-hardware-safety.html
Excellent link, fiat48 is who set up the hull I have and all the info he gives he did on the hull I now own, he's been at this for a LONG time and knows his stuff.

The advice you are getting here is very valuable and will keep you and your family safe, checking nuts and bolts regularly can not be stresses enough.

Great choice for your first V drive :))THumbsUp
 

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21 Bahner v drive

Hi all, first off, I'm new here. Wanted to post up a couple of pics showing off the new toy! This will be my first v drive, have had a number of fast outboards, one jet, can't wait to run this one. As far as I know, it's a 454 with an Art Carr trans. Casale v, etc...you guys could probably tell me more from the pics :) I did have a couple of questions:

- The cav plate adjustment motor is gone...just some plates and a hole in the transom. How critical will it be to get this sorted out before I run it? I'm anticipating that the cav plates on a boat like this are a bit more "optional" trim than they are on your more radical hot rod flats
- Anyone have experience with this hull? What should I expect speed wise out of a relatively mild BBC / v drive?
- Anything I should give a once over before I go get 'er wet?

Thanks!
- Rick
Rick that boat has the same bottom as the 21Eliminator Sport Crusier. That boat was probably rigged by Tommy Barron it looks very similar installation wise as a 21 Eliminator, and Tommy did a few of those while I was working there. If you decide to put big power in that boat it will have a tendency to roll into the right at higher speeds. These boats were set up for stock power and not high horsepower. Make's for a real good ski boat and crusier.
 

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v-drive help

i know i am on the east side of the state
there is some excellent help here in washington
the jerkzoid has the best connections on west and east side
i would pm him and he can hook you up for the west side
good luck with your nice ride
 

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v drive rookie
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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Excellent link, fiat48 is who set up the hull I have and all the info he gives he did on the hull I now own, he's been at this for a LONG time and knows his stuff.

The advice you are getting here is very valuable and will keep you and your family safe, checking nuts and bolts regularly can not be stresses enough.

Great choice for your first V drive :))THumbsUp
Thanks! Looking forward to getting it in the water.

Rick that boat has the same bottom as the 21Eliminator Sport Crusier. That boat was probably rigged by Tommy Barron it looks very similar installation wise as a 21 Eliminator, and Tommy did a few of those while I was working there. If you decide to put big power in that boat it will have a tendency to roll into the right at higher speeds. These boats were set up for stock power and not high horsepower. Make's for a real good ski boat and crusier.
Appreciate the additional info, very interesting. Good to know on the hull behavior...can that roll be tuned out with the cav plate?

i know i am on the east side of the state
there is some excellent help here in washington
the jerkzoid has the best connections on west and east side
i would pm him and he can hook you up for the west side
good luck with your nice ride
Excellent, really appreciate the local help. I'll certainly reach out when I find myself stumped.

Some additional pictures of my steering / prop shaft setup. A couple observations and questions:
- Looks like my rudder has a safety collar right above the bearing, is that sufficiently safe?
- I can see how the bolt holding the tiller arm on there could break and cause problems including moving and dropping the key...capture it with another collar?
- What is that odd looking stack next to the tiller arm / on the bearing carrier mounting bolt?
- What the heck am I looking at with those white bushings, rubber hose, and hose clamps??
- How do I go about lubricating where the prop shaft goes through the hull?
- Looks like there's a safety collar in the correct place on the prop shaft...though it's not the best type
- Am I correct that I have the weaker "4 bolt" coupler? If so, does this matter with a relatively mild boat like mine?
 

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I would definitely add another collar on top of the rudder shaft (top of the tiller. You can't have too many safety collars. I also would be concerned with the collar that is on the prop shaft. It appears to be a smaller diameter than the nylon shaft log seal nut. I think that if something came loose that the shaft could slip too far back.

Steve
 

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Any safety collars on the rudder and propshaft? Look for a collar on the prop shaft either just ahead of the strut of better, between the v-drive and the shaft log, or better yet, one each place. On the rudder, look at the key-way and how the rudder is held up from falling out of the hole.....is there something there to prevent that motion.

All bolts should have a wrench put to them before running the boat.......u-joints, motor mounts, trans mounts, v-drive mounts, seat mounts, steering cable attachments, fuel tanks, water lines, manifolds.....get the idea?

Since you have no way to keep the cav plates from moving either direction, I'd figure that out before launching.....you don't want them to suck down and dip the nose at speed, at minimum I'd stabilize them into a flat to the the bottom configuration but that really time and money wasted. Do it right the first time, either electric motor and push/pull rod or manual cav controls.

Report back!

Nice floater!
Carl how would the plates get sucked down at speed. Wouldnt the water pressure push them up if there was not motor connected to them????????
 

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Carl how would the plates get sucked down at speed. Wouldnt the water pressure push them up if there was not motor connected to them????????

the faster you go the more the the boat wants to lay down, it actually pulls a vacuum om the cav plates. when you have high spring pressures w/ stop. and or a up pedal on the cav plate, the water vacuum on the plate will help lift the bow when you lift the plate up past being flat with the bottom. you have to be carefull at how much past flat you have the plates lifted, too high and you run the chanced of getting too loose or blowing over. hope that helps maybe someone else can explain it better than me
 

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v drive rookie
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Discussion Starter #14
Hi Rick, I am local to you and have a Sanger mini v drive. Nice to see another v drive in the area.
Nice! I'll PM you, we should go for a run once the sun comes out.

I would definitely add another collar on top of the rudder shaft (top of the tiller. You can't have too many safety collars. I also would be concerned with the collar that is on the prop shaft. It appears to be a smaller diameter than the nylon shaft log seal nut. I think that if something came loose that the shaft could slip too far back.

Steve
Good notes, thanks Steve. Pulling that nylon shaft log seal nut assembly apart tomorrow. I'd like to make sure it's properly lubricated / assembled correctly. As well, need to figure out how I get that existing safety collar off as it's not a split type.

the faster you go the more the the boat wants to lay down, it actually pulls a vacuum om the cav plates. when you have high spring pressures w/ stop. and or a up pedal on the cav plate, the water vacuum on the plate will help lift the bow when you lift the plate up past being flat with the bottom. you have to be careful at how much past flat you have the plates lifted, too high and you run the chanced of getting too loose or blowing over. hope that helps maybe someone else can explain it better than me
I'd think the leverage of having the nose up in the air would want to naturally fall down too right? Combine that with suction from the water not wanting to release the plates and I could see how they'd flex down left unattended. Interesting that the opposite is true...pulling them up can lift that bow weight using the plate's suction on the water.
 

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v drive rookie
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Discussion Starter #15
More pictures, more help needed please

First of all, a big thank you to everyone who has replied here. I'm soaking up info like crazy, doing all kinds of reading on this board too. What a great resource it is for a new v drive guy!! Slid under the boat and found a few things that I'd like to ask you all about.

- There's a strange pattern in the gel near where the shaft strut is seated. It feels smooth and shiny in parts, then has a rough chalky texture near the strut mount. Any ideas as to what I'm looking at there?
- Looking at the strut mount to the boat it looks real ugly. How bad is this and do I need to go tear it all apart and re-seat / re-seal the whole assembly? I'm sure I have to win the award for ugliest prop strut install!
- Lose the whip strut? (that is the smaller strut right?) Guessing this prop shaft is a bit longer than average, might need it?
- Odd that the log mounting screws come through the bottom?
- Prop looks a little too far from the strut, yea?

Thanks again for the info here!!!
 

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v drive rookie
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Discussion Starter #16
Any thoughts on those bottom pictures?

An update, had the boat out this weekend for a little shakedown cruise. Ran fine, hit 56 on the GPS. Still have a list of things to take care of (tach, cav plates, etc). Quick video of me running it up to speed in 3rd from a standstill

3/3/13: 0 to 56 on Lake Sammamish - YouTube
 

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For your application I think the distance from the prop to the strut is fine. You can get a prop puller in there and have about an 1/8" to spare. The bottom looks like somone used bondo to fill in some broken/cracked areas in the gelcoat. Looks ugly, but shouldn't harm you. I would be more concerned with checking the prop, strut, and rudder for cracks with dye and developer just to make sure everything is safe for service.
 

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v drive rookie
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Discussion Starter #18
For your application I think the distance from the prop to the strut is fine. You can get a prop puller in there and have about an 1/8" to spare. The bottom looks like somone used bondo to fill in some broken/cracked areas in the gelcoat. Looks ugly, but shouldn't harm you. I would be more concerned with checking the prop, strut, and rudder for cracks with dye and developer just to make sure everything is safe for service.
Excellent, thank you. I'll start doing some research on dye
 

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No need to research it, it's basic crack checking dye/penetrant and developer. It's a two part process. There's also a pre-cleaner, but save a few bucks and just use brake cleaner. It's available at any welding shop, or online through McMaster Carr. Clean the parts, spray em with the red dye using clothes you don't like, allow to soak in 5 minutes or more, wipe off well, then spray on the developer. Goes on clear, dries flat white. Any cracks and the red dye will seep out into your flat white. Have fun~
 
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