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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello All.
I would like a opion on parts manufacturing in the USA... If a company says made in USA and you get that part in your hot hands,
and the first thing you see on a sealed bearing is Made in China... How would you feel? This happend to me by a well known company
The part is a starter sprag Circle
I have emailed their teck line, and no response.....
 

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Unless they are marketing themselves to only sell products made in the USA, who cares. Several USA workers made money from that foreign part.
 

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Unless they are marketing themselves to only sell products made in the USA, who cares. Several USA workers made money from that foreign part.
I take it business ethics aren't high up on your list. I would never misrepresent a product I sold to a customer its bad business plain and simple. The FTC actually goes after those that pull that. Under federal law something like 75% of the product has to be domestically produced to claim made in the USA. I might be off on the percentage.
 

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Unless they are marketing themselves to only sell products made in the USA, who cares. Several USA workers made money from that foreign part.
Yeah, a couple warehouse guys, a distributor, and dealer. No skill machinists, no heat treaters, no steel mill workers, no real wage earners. Just low wage stock boys and the importer.

Not too hard to spot the Obama sack fondlers on these forums.

Riverslide, there is a small chance that the gear was hobbed here, and only the bearing came from China. But I doubt it. More likely, the MADE part was the instruction sheet if there was one.



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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Yeah, a couple warehouse guys, a distributor, and dealer. No skill machinists, no heat treaters, no steel mill workers, no real wage earners. Just low wage stock boys and the importer.

Not too hard to spot the Obama sack fondlers on these forums.

Riverslide, there is a small chance that the gear was hobbed here, and only the bearing came from China. But I doubt it. More likely, the MADE part was the instruction sheet if there was one.
That is exactly what I feel !!! As a machinst among otheir things... I think it is close to fraud.....
 

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You'll find most bearings are imported from somewhere. Electronic components as well. I just happen to have a bearing on my desk here out of Magnaflow water pump (OE bearing). Its a Japanese bearing. Jet pump bearings and most wheel bearings - few are U.S. made. As manufacturing favorabilities change over time around the world, so does manufacturing location. Do I necessarily like it? No. Can I change it? No. Governments steer these things by implementing domestic and international policies and tariffs. My feelings on this Made is USA subject are well documented on this forum in probably a dozen other threads on the same topic. If you think I'm not pro Made in USA, think again. I just know what is reality. The cattle are a long time out of the barn.

A made in USA website my gf built and administers promoting Made in USA companies.
 

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I take it business ethics aren't high up on your list. I would never misrepresent a product I sold to a customer its bad business plain and simple. The FTC actually goes after those that pull that. Under federal law something like 75% of the product has to be domestically produced to claim made in the USA. I might be off on the percentage.
Please re-read my post. I said, if they claim it's made in the USA, ask for a refund, stop shopping there or do whatever you want.

If they didn't "lie" to you, well same thing. Return it, stop shopping there and carry on with your life. I think you are making a big deal or something small.

Yeah, a couple warehouse guys, a distributor, and dealer. No skill machinists, no heat treaters, no steel mill workers, no real wage earners. Just low wage stock boys and the importer.

Not too hard to spot the Obama sack fondlers on these forums.

Riverslide, there is a small chance that the gear was hobbed here, and only the bearing came from China. But I doubt it. More likely, the MADE part was the instruction sheet if there was one.
I like Obama? Wow, you really are a fucking retard dude.

So warehouse workers, forklift drivers, ups drivers, inventory workers, accounting people, shipping and receiving people, customer service people and etc don't matter? Interesting, I know people in these fields who are highly trained in what they do and some make some pretty damn good money too. More than a machinist.

Tell ya what, how about you guys go open a business and do what they do better, then open your big time wasting mouths. Until then shut the fuck up. :)

It's so pathetic how big of a deal you guys make over nothing. Log off the computer and go enjoy life once in awhile you negative cry babies!
 

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Even if it says made in the USA. It probably was not made by a USA citizen, at least if there was any labor involved, it was made by one of the 20 million undocumented aliens. I have a shop in a very heavy industrail area in Van Nuys. Thousands of workers come out at lunch. NOBODY speaks english.
 

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Please re-read my post. I said, if they claim it's made in the USA, ask for a refund, stop shopping there or do whatever you want.

If they didn't "lie" to you, well same thing. Return it, stop shopping there and carry on with your life. I think you are making a big deal or something small.



I like Obama? Wow, you really are a fucking retard dude.

So warehouse workers, forklift drivers, ups drivers, inventory workers, accounting people, shipping and receiving people, customer service people and etc don't matter? Interesting, I know people in these fields who are highly trained in what they do and some make some pretty damn good money too. More than a machinist.

Tell ya what, how about you guys go open a business and do what they do better, then open your big time wasting mouths. Until then shut the fuck up. :)

It's so pathetic how big of a deal you guys make over nothing. Log off the computer and go enjoy life once in awhile you negative cry babies!
X2:))THumbsUp
 

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I think it ought to be an Iron-clad law that if it says Made in USA it needs to be made here, and by a US Citizen......That way we can vote with our pocket-book.....and, no matter what you guys think, it works this way; US made by US biz, then Made in Mex or canada by US biz, then Made in USA by Foreign, then foreign made.....If you want to help keep this country afloat, you Buy US made by US companies....Consider a Family car; Honda made here vs a Ford made in Mex- 80% of the profit goes back to the corp, while a very small amount goes to the assemblers(Yes, here they make big money, but remember to divide by # of cars per hour)....The total amount for a family car payed to assemblers is approx $300, while corp profit is more like $10,000.....And at least the money spent assembling the Ford goes to our neighbors, which will hopefully slow the cross border traffic......The only time you see the money come back from Japan is when they buy part of the US....Either land, or Biz.....Zenith, Westinghouse, Music Company of America(MCA), etc....Hey at least RCA(Radio Co. of America) is owned by Thompson.....A FRENCH company?!
 

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Please re-read my post. I said, if they claim it's made in the USA, ask for a refund, stop shopping there or do whatever you want.

If they didn't "lie" to you, well same thing. Return it, stop shopping there and carry on with your life. I think you are making a big deal or something small.



I like Obama? Wow, you really are a fucking retard dude.

So warehouse workers, forklift drivers, ups drivers, inventory workers, accounting people, shipping and receiving people, customer service people and etc don't matter? Interesting, I know people in these fields who are highly trained in what they do and some make some pretty damn good money too. More than a machinist.

Tell ya what, how about you guys go open a business and do what they do better, then open your big time wasting mouths. Until then shut the fuck up. :)

It's so pathetic how big of a deal you guys make over nothing. Log off the computer and go enjoy life once in awhile you negative cry babies!
Misrepresenting a product is absolutely a big deal. Theres only one reason to mark made in the usa on a box and advertise it as such. Its to bait someone into a purchase. If you want to condone being a lying sack of shxt to make a sale, then have at it. As far as your comment about being in business, my payroll as of last friday was 28 people deep. You dont need to demonstrate your morals any further, its abundantly clear what type of person you are. Im sure you'd be ok with someone installing a different set of rods in that motor in your avatar then what you were told they were suppose to be and what you thought you were paying for. Ya right.
 

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So warehouse workers, forklift drivers, ups drivers, inventory workers, accounting people, shipping and receiving people, customer service people and etc don't matter? Interesting, I know people in these fields who are highly trained in what they do and some make some pretty damn good money too. More than a machinist.

Tell ya what, how about you guys go open a business and do what they do better, then open your big time wasting mouths. Until then shut the fuck up. :)

It's so pathetic how big of a deal you guys make over nothing. Log off the computer and go enjoy life once in awhile you negative cry babies!
What, you're so brain dead you think that American made parts somehow mysteriously avoid all those hands on the parts. You think American made parts don't get just as many beaks wet? somehow the parts made here mysteriously jump out the machine and land on your hand. How is that american made parts require less people to warehouse and move around the country than Chinese parts genius?
I could teach you a shit load on warehouse inventory, flooring costs, and shipping world wide. I sure as hell don't need your help.



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Unless they are marketing themselves to only sell products made in the USA, who cares. Several USA workers made money from that foreign part.
LOL!!! I bought new bearings from the John Deere dealership for my John Deere planter... All the bearings were made in China. I had three failures that caused significant down time, plus the doubt that the others would make the year. I found a non-factory distributor, bought every bearing he had that was made in the USA.

So chew on that! :)bit
 

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Lodge Cast Iron, South Pittsburg, Tenn, Since 1896, hell yeah !!!
Makers of fine cast iron skillets and dutch ovens !!!
It can be done in America, by Americans !!!:happy::happy::stir::stir::happy::happy:
 

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Where was your car made?

Something to at least give thought to. Being a Ford, Chevy, Chrysler, Toyota, Honda, means less these days.



By Scott Burgess RSS feed

Posted Jul 4th 2012 5:59PM
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Comments134


Put on your flag shorts and Liberty Bell hat. Cars.com has released its American-Made Index, proclaiming that four out of the top five American-made vehicles are Japanese brands.

The Toyota Camry, built in Kentucky, was ranked the most American vehicle sold today, with the Michigan-built Ford F-150 coming in as the second-most American vehicle. The Honda Accord, Toyota Sienna and Honda Pilot round out the top five. And yes, all of these models are available in red, white or blue.

Cars.com's criteria for selecting the most American vehicle includes sales volume, percentage of American sourced parts and where the vehicle is assembled. Vehicles must have at least 75 percent domestic parts to even qualify for the list, which kept the F-150 off last year.

However, the accounting system devised by Cars.com was called "flawed" by the American Automotive Policy Council, which represents Detroit's car makers in Washington D.C.

"The truth is: Three of the 16 major automakers doing business in the U.S. – Chrysler, Ford and GM – produce more than half the cars assembled here, use twice as many U.S. parts per vehicle than their competitors, are headquartered in the U.S. and employ two-thirds of America's autoworkers," said former Missouri Governor Matt Blunt, current president of the AAPC.

source




Home • Ask FactCheck • Is GM Becoming ‘China Motors’?
Is GM Becoming ‘China Motors’?
Posted on June 8, 2012
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Q: Is General Motors becoming ‘China Motors’ using taxpayer dollars?

A: No. The restructured GM is still based in Detroit and is still one-third owned by the U.S. government. But it sells nearly as many cars in China as in the U.S. and has continued expanding operations there.

FULL QUESTION

How much of this is true?

Subject: Video – No more GM cars for me!

WHAT AN EYE-OPENER!
No more GM cars for me.

Even if this were only half true it would light a fire under you. Trouble is, it’s ALL true !!!

CLICK ON the LINK below and open up your eyes….

General Motors is becoming China Motors - YouTube

YES, YOUR TAX MONEY AT WORK, THANKS TO THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION !!!!!



FULL ANSWER

Several readers have asked us about the claims stated in a viral video that criticizes General Motors’ expanding operations in China. The video has received more than half a million views on YouTube since it was posted May 4. The narrator, a man who gives his name as Vince Wade, asks: “Did we bail out GM so that it could become a Chinese company?”

It’s a fair question. The short answer is, “No.”

Still American

GM is still a U.S.-based multinational auto company, incorporated in Delaware and headquartered in Detroit. In fact, according to the Congressional Budget Office, about 33 percent of the stock in GM is still owned by the U.S. Treasury as a result of a taxpayer-assisted bankruptcy and downsizing in 2009.

But the company sells cars in more than 120 countries and accounted for nearly 12 percent of all car and truck sales worldwide last year (11.9 percent, according to GM’s annual report). It’s also true that China is now the largest market for car sales on earth. Total car sales in China surpassed those in the U.S. in 2009. China retained the lead in 2011, and that lead is expected to grow in the future.

So like it or not, the world’s automakers have been drawn to this huge and growing market, and GM has been particularly successful there. The video’s narrator clearly doesn’t like it.

His video asks, “Was the bailout a mistake?” And he goes on to quote an account criticizing GM’s Cadillac brand for supposedly currying favor with “the underworld mob that runs China.”

We won’t offer opinions on whether or not GM or any other company should be doing business in China, or on other controversial issues on which the narrator takes a stand. Our job is to look at the facts.

Overall, the video gives a one-sided picture. And on a couple of points it misleads. Here we offer a more complete and accurate picture, so readers may decide for themselves how they feel about GM’s dealings in China.

GM Expanding

Narrator Wade states that “GM has been shrinking its U.S. operations, while it’s aggressively expanding and investing in the People’s Republic of China.” But the fact is GM is currently expanding in both places.

It’s true that GM shrank much of its U.S. operations — shedding old brands and dealerships and many workers — when it went through bankruptcy in 2009. The alternative was to go out of business entirely.

But since then, the “new” GM has enjoyed expanding sales and operations. For example, it announced in January that it is building a new, $200 million stamping plant in Arlington, Texas. And it states: “Since June 2009, the company has announced more than $6.9 billion of investment to upgrade or expand operations in 12 states, creating or retaining more than 17,600 jobs.”

It’s true that GM also has been expanding in China — but that was true long before the bailout. The “old” GM (the one that went bankrupt) was the largest foreign car maker in China in 2008, battling for supremacy there with Volkswagen.

The “new” GM has continued that overseas success. It sold a record 231,183 vehicles in China in May, up 21 percent from a year earlier, for example. That compares with 245,256 vehicles sold in the United States, up 11 percent from a year earlier and the highest in 33 months.

Cost to Taxpayers

The video is also misleading as to the cost of taxpayer support. It cites a figure of $80 billion, which actually covers the government’s peak disbursements for both GM and Chrysler, as the narrator mentions in passing. But the net cost of the entire bailout is currently estimated to end up being $19 billion (by the Congressional Budget Office) to $22 billion (by the U.S. Treasury).

Most of that $80 billion has been recovered through interest payments, loan repayments and sale of government-owned stock. And of course, some portion of that is attributable to bailing out Chrysler.

Taxpayers still own about 33 percent of GM stock, according to CBO (other calculations put the total closer to 32 percent). Either way, the final cost of the bailout depends largely on whether the price of GM stock rises or falls between now and when the government decides to sell its shares.

So the better GM does, the less U.S. taxpayers will be hurt. And a key part of GM’s global business strategy is selling and manufacturing cars in China. As then-GM CEO Rick Wagoner said in 2008: “The automaker that gets China right will be the future leader of the industry.”

Global Auto Realities

Much of the video is devoted to showing GM Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Daniel F. Akerson explaining GM’s overseas operations to reporters in Shanghai in February 2011. Akerson noted that almost “seven out of 10 of our vehicles were made outside the United States” and that “we have 11 joint ventures” with government-owned Chinese companies (which the narrator later describes as partnerships with the “autocratic, anti-Democracy, Communist government of China”).

Akerson goes on to say, “We’re involved in vehicle manufacturing, sales, distribution, engineering design” and other auto-related businesses. He also said GM operates 11 assembly plants and four power train plants in eight cities in China.

That may sound surprising to some viewers, but the fact is that building and selling cars outside the home country is standard for multinational auto firms today. Japanese and German firms have many manufacturing facilities in the U.S., for example.

In fact, the top 10 “American-made” cars as ranked by Cars.com include three made by Toyota and two made by Honda (plus three made by GM, one by Ford and one by Jeep, a division of Chrysler, which is still U.S.-based but mostly owned by the Italian auto firm Fiat.) The single most “American” car made and sold in the U.S. today is the 2012 Toyota Avalon, with 85 percent domestic content (meaning parts made in either the U.S. or Canada), according to ratings published by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. Two GM passenger vans are tied for second, with 82 percent domestic content. (Toyota’s Matrix has 95 percent domestic content, more than any other vehicle sold in the U.S., but is assembled in Canada.)

GM’s facilities sprawl across the globe. Besides its plants in the U.S. and China, it is the third-largest car maker in Korea. It makes cars in Brazil, has owned Britain’s Vauxhall brand since 1925, and still owns the troubled Opel brand, manufactured in Germany, Poland and Britain, to cite a partial list.

Other Issues

Some of the more than nine-minute video is devoted to flaying Cadillac for its sponsorship of what the narrator describes as “a propaganda film, celebrating the anniversary of the founding of the Communist Party of China.” That much is true enough, and the video includes shots of the premiere with the Cadillac logo sharing the stage with the party’s hammer-and-sickle symbol.

But then the video quotes extensively from a story in the Epoch Times newspaper, in which the reporter cites a “suspicion” that GM was marketing Cadillacs to top party officials to curry their favor. But the full text of the story shows the reporter prefaced that by saying, “I have no proof.” So that speculation may or may not be accurate.

A statement that China’s leaders constitute an “underworld mob” — also quoted — is the opinion of the Epoch Times writer, Matthew Robertson. As the video narrator mentions, the Epoch Times leadership has numerous ties to the dissident Falun Gong movement. Followers were widely persecuted by the Chinese government, and that may color the newspaper’s reporting.

Another issue raised by the video is the sale of the Saginaw, Mich.-based GM supplier Nexteer to a Chinese firm. But the Wall Street Journal reported in February that the deal has turned out pretty well for U.S. workers: “Today, few people in town are wringing their hands about the Chinese. Inside a 59-year-old factory at Nexteer’s sprawling complex, contractors are ripping out antiquated machine lines and installing new equipment to produce an electronic steering system for the next generation of GM’s large pickup trucks and SUVs. The company, for years known as Saginaw Steering Gear, has hired more than 100 engineers in Saginaw last year and is looking for 80 more this year.”

The narrator is critical of both President Barack Obama and the probable Republican nominee Mitt Romney. He states that two big Romney supporters profited from the bailout. That’s based on a report by freelance investigative reporter and author Greg Palast. We can’t vouch for its accuracy. Palast is a veteran fraud investigator with an MBA from the University of Chicago. But as a journalist, he also has his critics.

We of course take no position on whether GM’s operations in China are a good thing or a bad thing, or whether the GM bailout should have been handled differently, or at all. We also take no position on whether car buyers should boycott GM, as the writer of one version of an email suggests in the headline. We only note that there are far fewer “tax dollars at work” than this video suggests, and that — like it or not — the auto business is global, China is the biggest market for cars on the planet, and if GM doesn’t build and sell cars there then others will. So the things this video finds distressing are happening with or without the bailout.

– Brooks Jackson

document source

Sources

Wade, Vince. “General Motors is becoming China Motors.” YouTube video. 4 May 2012.

“Report on the Troubled Asset Relief Program—March 2012.” Congressional Budget Office. 28 Mar 2012.

“About GM: Our Company.” General Motors Corp. Web page. Undated, accessed 7 Jun 2012.

General Motors Corp 2011 Annual Report; Form 10-K. Filed with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission. 27 Feb 2012.

Guillaume, Gilles. “China car sales top U.S.” Reuters. 11 Jan 2010.

Yan, Fang & Ken Wills. “UPDATE 1-China 2011 car sales gains at slowest annual pace.” Reuters. 12 Jan 2012.

Chrysler, Mack. “No Stopping China as Top Global Auto Market, Study Says.” WardsAuto. 4 Jan 2012.

Puzzanghera, Jim & Ken Bensinger. “GM proposes painful downsizing in bid for survival.” Los Angeles Times. 28 Apr 2009.

“GM Will Build $200 Million Stamping Facility in Texas.” General Motors Corp. news release. 31 Jan 2012.

Tang, Eugene & Stephen Engle. “GM Introduces Hybrid in China to Help Keep Sales Lead (Update1).” Bloomberg News. 21 Apr 2008.

“GM Sales in China Up 21.3 percent to set May Record: Sales for first five months of 1.2 million vehicles up 11.5 percent over 2011.″ General Motors Corp. news release. 5 Jun 2012.

“GM Reports Highest Monthly Sales in 33 Months.” General Motors Corp. news release. 1 Jun 2012.

U.S. Treasury Department. “Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP)Monthly Report to Congress – April 2012.” 10 May 2012.

Mays, Kelsey. “The Cars.com American-Made Index.” Cars.com. 27 Jun 2011.

Part 583 American Automobile Labeling Act (AALA) Reports. “AALA 2012 LISTED BY PERCENTAGE”. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration. 11 Mar 2012.

“GM in Korea.” General Motors Corp Web page. Undated, accessed 7 Jun 2012.

“General Motors to Invest $1 Billion in Brazil Operations.” Latin American Herald Tribune. 7 Jun 2012.

“Vauxhall in the UK.” General Motors Corp Web page. Undated, accessed 7 Jun 2012.

Cremer, Andreas. “Future of German Opel plant uncertain after 2014.” Reuters. 21 May 2012.

“Cadillac Sponsors Communist Propaganda Film.” ChinaAutoWeb. 2 Sep 2010.

Robertson, Matthew. “Cadillac Sponsors Chinese Communist Propaganda Bonanza, Foot in the Door.” Epoch Times. 17 May 2011.

Hua, Vanessa. “Dissident media linked to Falun Gong; Chinese-language print, broadcast outlets in U.S. are making waves.” San Francisco Chronicle. 18 Dec 2005.

Beaumont, Peter. “China’s Falun Gong crackdown: ‘The persecution is almost underground.’ ” The Guardian. 18 Jul 2009.

White, Joseph B. & Norihiko Shirozu. “In the Heart of the Rust Belt, Chinese Funds Provide the Grease.” The Wall Street Journal. 11 Feb 2012.

Palast, Greg. “Revealed: Romney’s Top Funders Made Billions on Auto Bail-Out.” Nation of Change: Progressive Journalism for Positive Action. 23 Feb 2012.

Galloway, George. “Et Tu, Greg Palast?; The Slime Artist.” Counterpunch. 20 Sep 2005.
 

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If the above was too much reading, check the label on your cell phone. :shock:
 

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That was a good and informative read Mike. Although cars have been manufactured outside the U.S. since the days of the Model T,with plants in So America, England, Europe, and Australia, none of the cars or parts ever found their way over here. And very few if any Amercian made parts found their way to those countries.
The GM rep is simply full of crap. If its possible to ship all the goods we receve from China everyday, its more than possible to ship 100% American made cars to China.
If GM thinks it is prudent to manufacture cars for Chinese use over there, maybe it would be prudent if we did the same for our phones, and computers.
Bottom line, I don't think we bailed out GM just so that they could move to China. I think we simply picked up the relocation costs for a move that has been in the works for sometime. Look at it as subsidizing the relocation of what was at one time the largest corporation on earth.



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Simple answer to a simple question > 'if' the so proudly positioned 'Made in America' sticker is on the product TO INCITE PURCHASE...yea, it pisses me off when it's not!
WTF :((((((
 
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