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I'd like your input. Medical Cannabis is legal in CA and several other states. The trend of thought is that it is likely to become part of CA law that a company cannot fire or reprimand an employee for testing positive for Medical Cannabis. Herein lies the dilemma for employers. Presently employers can do drug and alcohol tests and reprimand employees that test positive on the job for same, according to company's procedure for drug testing. If this law it passed a company will be unable to reprimand for a positive Cannabis test on a medical card holding patient. I am aware that impairment effects of the drug last a matter of hours. But the present test for the drug for the component THC will not be effective as THC can be present in a users blood for days to weeks following use, far beyond impairment period.

So given that, here is the rub. An employer won't be able to kick a person off the job if they test positive for medical Cannabis, stoned or not. Opens up a big can of worms imo regarding insurance and liability in the event such an employee has an accident, again stoned or not.

A solution would be some sort of different test that measured a person's impairment level (like alcohol) rather than THC blood level.

Further, it is likely at some point that Cannabis will become legal for general populace, things are moving in that direction. So then that compounds the level of the problem in that people using it for recreation rather than medical use become applicable (basically everyone).

With alcohol its easy to test for impairment. Cannabis, not so much.

I also don't think Cannabis use being legalized is a bad thing. I believe it to be far less damaging than the effects of alcohol. Those that argue its a gateway drug imo are simply uneducated on the subject. People that lean towards addiction will go there with or without Cannabis. I think alcohol is more likely to lead to serious drug use than Cannabis because it is used and abused far more. Alcohol is also addictive, Cannabis is not. Again education is key here if you think it is.

I'm looking for discussion though on only the issue as it affects employers, employees, testing, and liability associated with same. For or against Cannabis in general can be a discussion for a different thread if anyone so desires. I see this as an issue every CA employer and insurance company may soon have to face.
 

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Hi Rex. There is a test that they can use that will tell the difference if you smoked last night or if you have just smoked. Can't remember what it is. Measures a certain compound that goes away with time like alcohol. You will be seeing it's use more and more I am sure.
 

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Hi Rex. There is a test that they can use that will tell the difference if you smoked last night or if you have just smoked. Can't remember what it is. Measures a certain compound that goes away with time like alcohol. You will be seeing it's use more and more I am sure.

I know people that smoke at night just to go to sleep and wake up the next morning and go to work just fine. These are attorneys and doctors etc...

I think they need to come up with a test that can measure Blood Marijuana Levels just like Blood Alcohol Level that you can maybe breathe into and set a standard to where if you are over a certain BML level then you can get fired or arrested. I don't know if that will be something possible or not.
 

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Rexone; said:
I also don't think Cannabis use being legalized is a bad thing. I believe it to be far less damaging than the effects of alcohol. Those that argue its a gateway drug imo are simply uneducated on the subject. People that lean towards addiction will go there with or without Cannabis. I think alcohol is more likely to lead to serious drug use than Cannabis because it is used and abused far more. Alcohol is also addictive, Cannabis is not. Again education is key here if you think it is.

I'm looking for discussion though on only the issue as it affects employers, employees, testing, and liability associated with same. For or against Cannabis in general can be a discussion for a different thread if anyone so desires. I see this as an issue every CA employer and insurance company may soon have to face.
X2,,,,,,,,I haven't heard of any test, maybe EVIL can find out more about that. THC can be detected in a persons system up to 3 months after use of course that also depends on the person. I can see how that can play havoc with the employer since Insurance Companies will find any reason not to pay a claim.
 

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This has always been a tough subject. I agree that pot is not a gateway drug unless the user has low addictive tolerances and just wants to get high on sopmething. To me prescription drug abuse is getting to be a far larger and more serious problem than pot has ever been.

From what I've read the CA medical marijuana program has been nothing but a big mess and has furthered the major issues with pot in gerneral. Pot usage isn't going to end so it is time to just leagalize it and further ways to deal with it in the business and school worlds. Tests for beiong under the influence will need to be worked out and ways to keep it out of the workplace/school place will have to be developed and adopted just as with alcohol.
 

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mo balls than $cents$
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I know people that smoke at night just to go to sleep and wake up the next morning and go to work just fine. These are attorneys and doctors etc...

I think they need to come up with a test that can measure Blood Marijuana Levels just like Blood Alcohol Level and set a standard to where if you are over a certain BML level then you can get fired or arrested. I don't know if that will be something possible or not.
:)devil good post shintoo! i agree 210%, make a test that can enforce dui's and such, but the rest is bs. personally i dont think there's anything wrong with smokin it if you're of age, hell cigs are wayyyyyyy worse for you.
 

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I'd say the easy way is for the employer to secure a tiny small piece of federal business. You can then implement a drug free work place under the Drug-Free Workplace Act of 1988. Federal Law supercedes State law so you'll then be allowed to enforce your drug free work place. Until Marijuana is recognized by the Feds to be a legit medicine and legalized federally, your in the clear to hire/fire based upon positive drug tests.

The Drug-Free Workplace Act of 1988 section informs employers and workers about the Drug-Free Workplace Act of 1988, a law that requires some federal contractors and all federal grantees to provide drug-free workplaces as a precondition of receiving a contract or grant from a federal agency.
 

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Floatin dirty
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This has always been a tough subject. I agree that pot is not a gateway drug unless the user has low addictive tolerances and just wants to get high on sopmething. To me prescription drug abuse is getting to be a far larger and more serious problem than pot has ever been.

From what I've read the CA medical marijuana program has been nothing but a big mess and has furthered the major issues with pot in gerneral. Pot usage isn't going to end so it is time to just leagalize it and further ways to deal with it in the business and school worlds. Tests for beiong under the influence will need to be worked out and ways to keep it out of the workplace/school place will have to be developed and adopted just as with alcohol.

I have to strongly disagree with you on this OT. I have encountered countless habitual drug users over the years, young kids just getting started all the way to old 70 year old heroin users and one thing that is apparent is that the vast majority of them began their drug use with MJ and then progressed to the harder drugs. I do agree that smoking cigs is also very harmful to the body over time and nicotine has been shown to be addictive also.

Not to deviate to far from the thread topic but medical MJ may have some medicinal use and purpose for certain types of illness such as pain relief from cancer but the majority of the "so called" doctor ordered prescriptions for medical MJ are just scams. You can walk off the street into hundreds of different clinics and get one prescribed for anything.

Rex, there may be some different types of tests that can show recent usage but I am not sure if you can get an accurate result showing useage within say 2 hours versus 12 hours ago. I can see where liability issues for a business owner may arise if you have an employee who may have a legitimate medical reason for needing MJ for pain relief and his ability to perform his work related duties. Maybe requiring the employee to provide a medical release from his doctor indicating that he is fit for regular work in spite of his current condition and medication needs would give you some protection in the event of a work related incident.
 

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Well considering marijuana was almost legalized this last go round, I would imagine it will pass next election. So you won't have to worry about it soon. You can implement rules after that just the same as no drinking on the job. If you don't want stoners working for you it will be your right to make that judgment.

and just because it's legal to use it for medical purposes doesn't mean you have to hire someone who is impared at work. For instance if you feel it necessary to relieve someone of their duty because they are under the influence of a prescribed pain killer you have that right by law. Same should follow with 420 law. As far as the testing, follow the same rules the police do. If they feel you are intoxicated upon pulling you over and test you for marijuana and find reasonable levels of THC they can arrest you for a DUI, regardless if it was from last week or last night.
 
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This has always been a tough subject. I agree that pot is not a gateway drug unless the user has low addictive tolerances and just wants to get high on something. To me prescription drug abuse is getting to be a far larger and more serious problem than pot has ever been.

From what I've read the CA medical marijuana program has been nothing but a big mess and has furthered the major issues with pot in gerneral. Pot usage isn't going to end so it is time to just leagalize it and further ways to deal with it in the business and school worlds. Tests for beiong under the influence will need to be worked out and ways to keep it out of the workplace/school place will have to be developed and adopted just as with alcohol.

OT, still is a tough subject. Those who insist that MJ is a gateway drug always seem to ignore that alcohol was the first drug used by most addicts. Those with additive personalities and little will power, will generally end up addicted to something. I also agree with your assessment on the problems with prescription drugs. Legalizing pot and dealing with it in a manner similar alcohol and tobacco seems inevitable.

The CA medical marijuana program for the most part provides the user easy, somewhat legal, access to the finest quality products, while providing little benefit to the State.

It is my understanding that there are several tests in the completion stage that will test for under the influenced of THC while ignoring trace amounts With medical marijuana programs now in many States, this type of testing is a must.
 

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I am not sure how it applies to everyday screening but after a work place accident we use a blood test. Marijuana is only detectable in the blood for a few hours after use. The metabolites will show up in urine for weeks. They use the blood test to prove that the use was immediately before or during work hours. Also these were ocip programs so I dont know if they allow this for wc or not.
 

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Floatin dirty
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OT, still is a tough subject. Those who insist that MJ is a gateway drug always seem to ignore that alcohol was the first drug used by most addicts. Those with additive personalities and little will power, will generally end up addicted to something. I also agree with your assessment on the problems with prescription drugs. Legalizing pot and dealing with it in a manner similar alcohol and tobacco seems inevitable.

The CA medical marijuana program for the most part provides the user easy, somewhat legal, access to the finest quality products, while providing little benefit to the State.

It is my understanding that there are several tests in the completion stage that will test for under the influenced of THC while ignoring trace amounts With medical marijuana programs now in many States, this type of testing is a must.

I do agree with you that a large percentage of young people who begin experimenting with drug useage also involved or preceeded it with alcohol useage as well.
 

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Marine Organism
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trying hard to stay on topic.

I have found that it varies from WC companies. My prior WC insurance co had me keep piss cups on hand. The latest one, no.
 

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Well considering marijuana was almost legalized this last go round, I would imagine it will pass next election. So you won't have to worry about it soon. You can implement rules after that just the same as no drinking on the job. If you don't want stoners working for you it will be your right to make that judgment.

and just because it's legal to use it for medical purposes doesn't mean you have to hire someone who is impared at work. For instance if you feel it necessary to relieve someone of their duty because they are under the influence of a prescribed pain killer you have that right by law. Same should follow with 420 law. As far as the testing, follow the same rules the police do. If they feel you are intoxicated upon pulling you over and test you for marijuana and find reasonable levels of THC they can arrest you for a DUI, regardless if it was from last week or last night.
It was passed this go around. :D
 

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Our company (based out of Ohio) has already issued a notice saying that regardless of what state law is in effect you can still be terminated for testing positive for marijuana regardless of what rx you have.
 

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A solution would be some sort of different test that measured a person's impairment level (like alcohol) rather than THC blood level.

I'm looking for discussion though on only the issue as it affects employers, employees, testing, and liability associated with same. .
I've seen signs up in Walmart, "to apply for job, you must pass drug test, please don't waste our time" and still half of them fail the test.

I know a Firestone tire guy who can't find people to hire, cuz he gets a discount on w comp if they can pass a test.


, follow the same rules the police do. If they feel you are intoxicated ... they can arrest you for a DUI, regardless .

So I think you're looking for a skills test, rather than a blood test.
Same as field sobriety tests cops use. If you're employee can't pass, send him home or fire him.
Cop question: Does nystagmus work for THC?
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I'd say the easy way is for the employer to secure a tiny small piece of federal business. You can then implement a drug free work place under the Drug-Free Workplace Act of 1988. Federal Law supercedes State law so you'll then be allowed to enforce your drug free work place. Until Marijuana is recognized by the Feds to be a legit medicine and legalized federally, your in the clear to hire/fire based upon positive drug tests.

The Drug-Free Workplace Act of 1988 section informs employers and workers about the Drug-Free Workplace Act of 1988, a law that requires some federal contractors and all federal grantees to provide drug-free workplaces as a precondition of receiving a contract or grant from a federal agency.
I realize there are conflicting fed and state laws within CA. However, we as businesspeople get to deal with this agency, a CA state agency, on labor related issues including unlawful termination. California Labor and Workforce Development Agency

So I see it as a can of worms for the business person. No small business can afford to go to court and defend themselves against from an unlawful termination lawsuit just because the inequity between federal and state law exists. And I see exactly that happening. Employer practices liability insurance is also expensive and is probably about to get much more so in light of the above.
 

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I have to strongly disagree with you on this OT. I have encountered countless habitual drug users over the years, young kids just getting started all the way to old 70 year old heroin users and one thing that is apparent is that the vast majority of them began their drug use with MJ and then progressed to the harder drugs. I do agree that smoking cigs is also very harmful to the body over time and nicotine has been shown to be addictive also.

I have to strongly disagree with you, I have known, I could also say countless, people that have and still are smoking MJ for 20 -40 years. They don't drink much if at all and don't do any hard drugs, many are very succesful in their professions and many of them also have retired in their 50's and a few I know have retired in their late forties. So to say MJ is a stepping stone to hard drugs is BS. Those that do get addicted to hard drugs are weak. They would get addicted to hard drugs without MJ, which there are many other options besides MJ. One more thing to mention is that Cigs are way way much harder to quit than MJ. Nicotene is much much more addictive.
 
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