Performance Boats Forum banner

1 - 12 of 12 Posts

·
Temporarily Pacified!
Joined
·
5,554 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Senator Chuck Schumer (D-NY) encouraged President Obama and his administration to "explore" the validity of using the 14th amendment to raise the debt ceiling, rather than seek Congressional approval every time.


The rights answer:

GOP Congressman: "Impeachable Offense" If Obama Bypasses Congress On Debt Ceiling"This president is looking to usurp congressional oversight to find a way to get it done without us. My position is that is an impeachable act from my perspective. There are a lot of things people say, 'Are you going to impeach the president over that?' — No. But this? This is catastrophic. This jeopardizes the credibility of our nation if one man can usurp the entire system set up by our founding fathers over something this significant," Rep. Tim Scott (R-SC) said.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
6,729 Posts
Has anyone ever told you that you were a day late and a dollar short? They have been discussing whether the debt ceiling is constitutional for over a month now.
 

·
Temporarily Pacified!
Joined
·
5,554 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Has anyone ever told you that you were a day late and a dollar short? They have been discussing whether the debt ceiling is constitutional for over a month now.
Thats not the basis of this post jackass, read it. Schumer is pushing the White House to use the 14th Amendment for the President, and only the President, to decide to raise it.....taking congress out of the loop. Do you agree with said spitting on the constitution?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
25,975 Posts
Do you agree with said spitting on the constitution?
You really felt compelled to ask that question because......you were mistakenly thinking you might get a answer? spit on it? Seriously? Thats all? Not burn it, or tear it up. Just spit on it and allow the saviour save our country from itself and the selfish republican corporate war machine.
You would suggest the President allow the entire country go into default, keep ram from a paycheck, and zombie from his pension check because of a stupid piece of 240 year old paper written by a bunch of religious fanatics. Get a grip donzi!
There is no way they could have known we would be in the capable hands of a messiah and economic genius when they wrote that nonsense.



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
6,729 Posts
Thats not the basis of this post jackass, read it. Schumer is pushing the White House to use the 14th Amendment for the President, and only the President, to decide to raise it.....taking congress out of the loop. Do you agree with said spitting on the constitution?
They have been talking about this for over a month. There are questions whether Congress even has the authority to set a debt ceiling. The question revolves around if Congress can deny payment of US debt, if we reach the debt ceiling. There is not much case law on it other than a supreme court case in 1935 which states that the part of the 14th amendment refers to all US debt because it was originally written after the civil war with the intent to let all the creditors then know that the US would not, or could not by law default on its debt. So if the US can not by law default on its debt, the debt ceiling is an imaginary barrier, and payments will be made to creditors no matter where the debt ceiling is. From what I have read, the only way Obama would consider doing this is if the GOP decides not to work with the Dems to extend the debt ceiling, and instead attempt to shut down the government saying that an acceptable agreement to increase the debt ceiling cannot be made. I really doubt Obama or The GOP leadership in Congress would want it to happen, because there is a chance the economy would implode which is good for no one, and it would also create a big legal mess with the government possibly being shut down untill the whole mess was hashed out in the courts. I really think the debt ceiling will end up being extended, and much of the new info leaking out latley is nothing more than political drama. Obama has said he would consider cutting social security and medicare, and the GOP leadership has said it would consider defense spending cuts and eliminating tax loopholes, which effectively raises taxes. I would like to see them get something done to buy some time, and then really get into the tax code, preferably throwing it out and writing a completely new one, as well as make big cuts in spending. Only time will tell what will happen, and I'm sure it will be an interesting drama filled show to watch before it is all over.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,426 Posts
They have been talking about this for over a month. There are questions whether Congress even has the authority to set a debt ceiling. The question revolves around if Congress can deny payment of US debt, if we reach the debt ceiling. There is not much case law on it other than a supreme court case in 1935 which states that the part of the 14th amendment refers to all US debt because it was originally written after the civil war with the intent to let all the creditors then know that the US would not, or could not by law default on its debt. So if the US can not by law default on its debt, the debt ceiling is an imaginary barrier, and payments will be made to creditors no matter where the debt ceiling is. From what I have read, the only way Obama would consider doing this is if the GOP decides not to work with the Dems to extend the debt ceiling, and instead attempt to shut down the government saying that an acceptable agreement to increase the debt ceiling cannot be made. I really doubt Obama or The GOP leadership in Congress would want it to happen, because there is a chance the economy would implode which is good for no one, and it would also create a big legal mess with the government possibly being shut down untill the whole mess was hashed out in the courts. I really think the debt ceiling will end up being extended, and much of the new info leaking out latley is nothing more than political drama. Obama has said he would consider cutting social security and medicare, and the GOP leadership has said it would consider defense spending cuts and eliminating tax loopholes, which effectively raises taxes. I would like to see them get something done to buy some time, and then really get into the tax code, preferably throwing it out and writing a completely new one, as well as make big cuts in spending. Only time will tell what will happen, and I'm sure it will be an interesting drama filled show to watch before it is all over.
Since you've researched this then you already know that there's now way the US would default on the debt. The US takes in 200 billion a month in tax revenue, so paying the bill to our debtors is a non issue. This is a total scare tactic. They may have to cut back on a few paychecks for people on the Government dole but the rest of this Obama circus is pure theatrics.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
25,975 Posts
so what your say ram, and lets cool our jets here so you can answer this with a sound mind. What you saying is the president can run the budget thru the ceiling anytime he likes, pass free for everybody health care, and a new Lambo in every garage, and raise the SS checks to all, and the NEXT congress after the nut swingers are out, has to honor those debts, regardless if they bankrupt the country, and require the printing presses to run 24/7.

Are you still sure our dollar is backed by nothing more than FAITH? Would you loan money to a country that screwed up. Would you feel confident in a country with that kind of finacial restraint.

What good is it to say you'll pay the debt, and raise the ceiling NO MATTER WHAT, if your only going to print money to cover it. I said this before, the only difference between the US and the state of Calif is tha Calif doesn't own a printing press.



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
25,975 Posts
Since you've researched this then you already know that there's now way the US would default on the debt. The US takes in 200 billion a month in tax revenue, so paying the bill to our debtors is a non issue. This is a total scare tactic. They may have to cut back on a few paychecks for people on the Government dole but the rest of this Obama circus is pure theatrics.
I wouldn't be so certain its an Obama scare tactic. The republicans are pretty serious about this. And it doesn't matter if the money is there or not, congress has to pass the at least an extention to pay it out. The MONEY is only as far away as the printing presses. don't think that the money coming in gets it done. It doesn't. Thats why its called a DEFICIT, which every DAY is added to the DEBT. Every DAY the government comes up short. Every single day. So they AGREE to borrow, or print more money. Thats what they are suppose to be doing right now. They agreed to borrow, or print enough to get the government thru aug 2 the last time. They can play the same stupid game again, and "kick the can" down the road. But sooner or later, they will hit the end of the road, and the lenders will say enough. And their FAITH in the US dollar as ram like to call it will cease.



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
6,729 Posts
Since you've researched this then you already know that there's now way the US would default on the debt. The US takes in 200 billion a month in tax revenue, so paying the bill to our debtors is a non issue. This is a total scare tactic. They may have to cut back on a few paychecks for people on the Government dole but the rest of this Obama circus is pure theatrics.
It's not a scare tactic, but it is theatrics, and not just from the left. The Treasury would pay the foreign debtors first, and probably pay the fed last. But that's not the problem if we reach the "debt ceiling" and "potentially default" on our debts. The problem, and it's a real problem, is if this happens, it could lower the credit rating that the US currently has. That means it would cost more to borrow money, and we are not in a position right now where we could realistically go without borrowing money. If things go well, and we make big cuts to the budget, while also raising revenues (taxes), we will be in the position to go without borrowing one day, but that day is not today, or in the near future. That's the serious danger, not that we may default on our debt.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
6,729 Posts
so what your say ram, and lets cool our jets here so you can answer this with a sound mind. What you saying is the president can run the budget thru the ceiling anytime he likes, pass free for everybody health care, and a new Lambo in every garage, and raise the SS checks to all, and the NEXT congress after the nut swingers are out, has to honor those debts, regardless if they bankrupt the country, and require the printing presses to run 24/7.

Are you still sure our dollar is backed by nothing more than FAITH? Would you loan money to a country that screwed up. Would you feel confident in a country with that kind of finacial restraint.

What good is it to say you'll pay the debt, and raise the ceiling NO MATTER WHAT, if your only going to print money to cover it. I said this before, the only difference between the US and the state of Calif is tha Calif doesn't own a printing press.
I'm not saying that. From what I have read, there is a good possibility that it is against the law for the US Treasury to not pay its debts. It would come down to the opinion of the Supreme Court, but this is what the dreaded "legal scholars" are saying. The US is borrowing money to pay it's debts now, and has probably since the nations founding. Remember when Bush did the first tax cut and everyone got a check in the mail because of budget surplusses? The US Treasury didn't have all that money sitting in a savings account somewhere, they borrowed it. That's how governments operate. Shit, most businesses also operate on credit to pay their bills and payroll etc, that's just the way things work.

One thing that you forget when you bring up what backs the USD is that the US is an advanced large economy. We still are the leading manufacturing country in the world, we are the technological innovators of the world, we have the world's biggest military to defend our economic interests, our productivity is near the top for advanced nations if it isn't number one, and our economy is pretty stable. That's where the faith that the rest of the world has in our economy comes from, not because something the Congress or the President does or does not do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,426 Posts
I wouldn't be so certain its an Obama scare tactic. The republicans are pretty serious about this. And it doesn't matter if the money is there or not, congress has to pass the at least an extention to pay it out. The MONEY is only as far away as the printing presses. don't think that the money coming in gets it done. It doesn't. Thats why its called a DEFICIT, which every DAY is added to the DEBT. Every DAY the government comes up short. Every single day. So they AGREE to borrow, or print more money. Thats what they are suppose to be doing right now. They agreed to borrow, or print enough to get the government thru aug 2 the last time. They can play the same stupid game again, and "kick the can" down the road. But sooner or later, they will hit the end of the road, and the lenders will say enough. And their FAITH in the US dollar as ram like to call it will cease.
The scare tactic is the defaulting part, we won't default on our debtors. I equate it to paying interest only on a loan. After that, I totally agree this is a very serious problem, and I commend the Republican leaders for standing their ground....SO FAR. Obama is directly responsible for a huge chunk of this debt that a vast majority of us didn't want any part of. Now he wants another credit limit extension without strings or accountability. By not allowing this, I think we're showing or lenders we are serious about controlling or debt responsibly. If we cave, watch what happens then, the world will know we're a bunch of idiots.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
25,975 Posts
Leaving out the ridiculous notion that no matter what the president and congress do, that our money is still solid your pretty dead on. Now the FAITH may be in the HOPES that the president and the congress are going to keep their wits about them. You know as well as I do they can't just run the presses till they break or run out ot paper. They are limits the creditors will allow. Right now, today, the American public is the loargest creditor to the US government. Always has been. right now it is in the form a of SS and T bills.

The "legal" wording for our dollar goes somehting like The resources, natural and manufacturing production, and the ability to tax AND collect moneys from the public.
which I guess you could say roughly translates to the GDP and and the ability to collect taxes.
But, as the GDP goes down, the revenues go down, and the debt climbs. Then the trick is to increase the GDP and the revenues BOTH. Not just revenues, because the has throught out history proven to hamper GDP. Kind if a tight rope.

And then there is the novel idea most householdS do......STOP SPENDING LIKE A DRUNKEN SAILOR ON SHORE LEAVE!



100% free webcam site! | Awesome chicks and it is absolutely free! | Watch free live sex cam - easy as 1-2-3
 
1 - 12 of 12 Posts
Top