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Discussion Starter #1
Hey guys, I have noticed that alot of V-drive flats seem to turn much better than my Hondo Flat...I have a fair sized rudder but also a much larger skeg than some I have seen in pics. Mine is about 9" deep at the aft end and about 16" long... Any suggestions as to how to address this problem with out making the boat squirrely? It handles very well at speed just cant hardly turn around without coming right off plane in a river, letalone making any kind of a corner at any kind of speed she just wants to go straight...It's a drag setup boat so I dont expect it to carve a corner but seems to be much different than what I see in your videos as far as cruise speed/slow speed handling? Any thoughts? skeg change? rudder configuration? Or is it just the nature of the beast? I dont find it to be a huge issue but wondering if there is a good solution.

Thanks guys,
Andrew
 

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True flat, or runner bottom? Runners are not gonna turn that great, but should turn w/o coming off plane certainly. One thought comes to mind your rudder may be turning too far (no stops) and basically going near perpendicular to the prop, boat will not turn when this happens. Probably not your problem but I have seen it. Boat starts to turn well, driver cranks wheel further, boat stalls out and stops turning. How big a rudder and what blade style?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
True flat, or runner bottom? Runners are not gonna turn that great, but should turn w/o coming off plane certainly. One thought comes to mind your rudder may be turning too far (no stops) and basically going near perpendicular to the prop, boat will not turn when this happens. Probably not your problem but I have seen it. Boat starts to turn well, driver cranks wheel further, boat stalls out and stops turning. How big a rudder and what blade style?
Its a true flat, also I don't think it's an issue of the rudder turning too far. The boat turns more with more steering input and does not come close to purpendicular to the prop (a bit over 45* if memory serves me, as I am away from home on work). The rudder is about 14" long as it hangs roughly 2" below the prop, it trails the rudder shaft, about 4" at the top and tapers to maybe 6-7" at the bottom. It passes through the trim plate just inside the transom, with the prop being about 2-3" forward... I notice that circle boats seam to have prop further under the hull and assume this helps them cut a faster corner?

I have a video of the boat making a turn and then a launch on youtube, I am off plane and that is about as tight as the boat will turn. If you watch the vid you can see where I pick up the throttle a little bit during the turn and loose turn rate... also you can see the size and depth of the skeg when I hang the nose on the launch... search V-drive hondo BBC, it's an orange and yellow boat 0:43 second video and my name is Flat BROKE 612 on youtube also.. As I said, it's not a HUGE issue but you really have to plan any dock approches as at slow speed it's terrible, also no chance of turning around in a 200-250' wide river with a slalom skier up...wont happen! This maybe completely normal as this is one of the few V-drives in my area, therefor the only one I have any real world experiance on! But I do notice in alot of vids similar looking boats seam to turn much better...

Thanks for the reply!
Andrew
 

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You're barely off idle and then slowing as you turn! Are you on the down pedal when you turn? Do you have an inch of plate movement to work with?

Your boat looks and sounds really good to me and it appears to set well!

 

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drag boat runner<< sorry It did not turn right very great. :D

any video of it turning on-plane at decent speed, say 40-50? It should easily crank around at skiing speed. Does it have a down pedal or cav handle only? Are you applying and down plate when you turn (plowing off-plane turns don't count :D)?
 

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I agree with Rex! I've got a lot of seat time driving one of those and they turn pretty decent. Get the boat up to more speed, hit the down pedal and slide it around.
 

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If the bow is buried when turning it will plow and not turn, the bow shoud be up. Flat and the fins will run straight with the hull.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I agree with Rex! I've got a lot of seat time driving one of those and they turn pretty decent. Get the boat up to more speed, hit the down pedal and slide it around.
Ya that video was taken when I literally had 1 1/2 hrs of seat time in the boat with the big block...so was still feeling it out for sure. But even after experimenting a bit, on the down a bit, at 30-40mph it doesnt "slide around" like some others I have seen video of. With pretty much any throttle input it will just override the rudder and the boat goes straight. The small river (just off of where that video is taken) is a couple hunderd feet wide or better and I cant turn around on plane, also it has some lazy bends, if im running the river quick, say 90 mph I can make the bends, the boat feels planted to the water and reacts to the rudder, but anymore throttle you suddenly loose steering and she goes straight as an arrow even with a fair bit of down peddle for that speed... at full throttle turning the wheel only results in dropping the tach a couple hundred RPM, not a hint of steering...

The cav plate is set to allow slightly over 1" down and 1/8"up, in the neutral position it is level with the hull center and gullwings down 1/8" at the chines. I am hesitant to change much because the boat is very stable even gps'ing at 118mph, not a hint of chine walk or anything funny just doesn't turn! I would be more interested in cruising speed turning than high speed, just make life easier when skiing or in tight quarters. But I also dont want to do anything to make it unsafe at higher speeds.

I will try to find some videos of it turning on plane....

Thanks guys
Andrew
 

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Turn

There is somthing really wrong here. I suggest you try some on the trailer testing. Have you tried holding the rudder in place (fix it) and turn the wheel. You might have a problem in the sterring column (gear slipping). This boat should turn very well at any speed.Also look at the rudder attachment to cable attachment, there is a key in both locations (double check both areas)
Let us know what you find.
 

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If the bow is buried when turning it will plow and not turn, the bow shoud be up. Flat and the fins will run straight with the hull.
Want to clarify what I was trying to describe. Sorry the pic is blurry .... where the water is breaking the skag is partially out of the water. By adding some/just enough down peddle to bring the nose down so the boat runs flatter on the water is what I was trying to describe. Not burrying the nose sorry for the confusing reply.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
There is somthing really wrong here. I suggest you try some on the trailer testing. Have you tried holding the rudder in place (fix it) and turn the wheel. You might have a problem in the sterring column (gear slipping). This boat should turn very well at any speed.Also look at the rudder attachment to cable attachment, there is a key in both locations (double check both areas)
Let us know what you

Yes to all the above, I have been through all the rigging, keys are all tight and in place. You can feel it in the wheel when the rudder stops "holding" the water, if you let out of the throttle the boat will beging to turn to match the wheel input, and the wheel always returns to center with the rudder straight. That being said, I'm pretty sure its not a matter of the rudder not being attatched to the steering wheel, but but a problem with the rudder configuration or the skeg or the boat setup in general? It does turn nicely at cruise speeds, a little down helps but wont turn very sharp at all. I tried allowing the rudder to travel farther but it gets to a point where no more helps either:bangmyhead:. As I said earlier, this is the ONLY V-drive I have EVER been in so not sure if this is normal for my boats configuration or if I can make a change for the better. A friend of mine has an old circle boat (never been in it) but he says it will turn so hard it will damn near toss u out of the boat! If I recall his has hull strakes and the prop is waaaay under the hull (mine is right near the cav plate), I know it's not a circle boat but seems like it should turn better...

Were you able to get a look at the size of the skeg in the video? it seams alot larger than others pictured on PB...could trimming it down help out with out making negative effects on handling at high speed in particular?

Thanks guys
Andrew
 

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Were you able to get a look at the size of the skeg in the video? it seams alot larger than others pictured on PB...could trimming it down help out with out making negative effects on handling at high speed in particular?

Thanks guys
Andrew[/QUOTE]

I saw it, it looks like what I had under my Fresno....it turned fine.

Again sorry for the blurry pic, you can tell the pic is from a distance and old but the skag looks to be close to same size.

Wish I could be more help...

David
 

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Can you get some pix of the cav plate and rudder/prop/strut?

I noticed that you've said a couple of times that your prop is way back by the cav plate, we need to see what you're describing.......

CC
 

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Im not sure what the problem is but ill second everyone else. My hondo runner turns on a dime. In fact I have more fun spinning circles around bouys than I do going fast straight.

BTW When I was building my flat I must have watched your youtube vids 100 times to see what my boat was gonna look like in the water!
 

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Ya that video was taken when I literally had 1 1/2 hrs of seat time in the boat with the big block...so was still feeling it out for sure. But even after experimenting a bit, on the down a bit, at 30-40mph it doesnt "slide around" like some others I have seen video of. With pretty much any throttle input it will just override the rudder and the boat goes straight. The small river (just off of where that video is taken) is a couple hunderd feet wide or better and I cant turn around on plane, also it has some lazy bends, if im running the river quick, say 90 mph I can make the bends, the boat feels planted to the water and reacts to the rudder, but anymore throttle you suddenly loose steering and she goes straight as an arrow even with a fair bit of down peddle for that speed... at full throttle turning the wheel only results in dropping the tach a couple hundred RPM, not a hint of steering...

The cav plate is set to allow slightly over 1" down and 1/8"up, in the neutral position it is level with the hull center and gullwings down 1/8" at the chines. I am hesitant to change much because the boat is very stable even gps'ing at 118mph, not a hint of chine walk or anything funny just doesn't turn! I would be more interested in cruising speed turning than high speed, just make life easier when skiing or in tight quarters. But I also dont want to do anything to make it unsafe at higher speeds.

I will try to find some videos of it turning on plane....

Thanks guys
Andrew
A couple things here stand out to me and not trying to be a smart ass. 118 seems very fast for a hondo flat, way fast. Especially one not set up specifically for drag racing. The ss kilo record is only in the 120's. 90 is fast in a hondo true flat. 100+ would be considered "very" fast for that hull.

But, regardless of top speed you shouldn't be trying to turn the boat at full throttle, they really don't do that well, nor is it wise, especially if you have little driving experience in this type of boat. You can end up on your head pretty easy with this scenario. And no the wheel probably won't turn due to extreme pressure on the rudder at that speed.


There is somthing really wrong here. I suggest you try some on the trailer testing. Have you tried holding the rudder in place (fix it) and turn the wheel. You might have a problem in the sterring column (gear slipping). This boat should turn very well at any speed.Also look at the rudder attachment to cable attachment, there is a key in both locations (double check both areas)
Let us know what you

Yes to all the above, I have been through all the rigging, keys are all tight and in place. You can feel it in the wheel when the rudder stops "holding" the water, if you let out of the throttle the boat will beging to turn to match the wheel input, and the wheel always returns to center with the rudder straight. That being said, I'm pretty sure its not a matter of the rudder not being attatched to the steering wheel, but but a problem with the rudder configuration or the skeg or the boat setup in general? It does turn nicely at cruise speeds, a little down helps but wont turn very sharp at all. I tried allowing the rudder to travel farther but it gets to a point where no more helps either:bangmyhead:. As I said earlier, this is the ONLY V-drive I have EVER been in so not sure if this is normal for my boats configuration or if I can make a change for the better. A friend of mine has an old circle boat (never been in it) but he says it will turn so hard it will damn near toss u out of the boat! If I recall his has hull strakes and the prop is waaaay under the hull (mine is right near the cav plate), I know it's not a circle boat but seems like it should turn better...

Were you able to get a look at the size of the skeg in the video? it seams alot larger than others pictured on PB...could trimming it down help out with out making negative effects on handling at high speed in particular?

Thanks guys
Andrew
The above highlight seems somewhat contradictory. Not quite sure what to make of it. What do you consider cruise speeds, 40 or 90? There is a significant difference. The boat should turn well at 40. Probably not well (or wise to try) at 90.

I don't think the fin size is an issue. Many older recreational flats have similar fins. Only the actual drag boats have little tiny fins (because they are not turning and to minimize drag at speed).

Still scratching my head on all this. Some part of this puzzle is still missing.
 
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